Should DVC eliminate walking?

[Sandisw]

Possible as it’s first come, first served. Someone could beat you to the phone. But never happened in my years of booking. Plus, as I’ve said before, if that were to happen that room would likely be gone anyway with walking under the new system.

Not correct. Todays system guarantees that if you can get day 1, you can get as many continuous nights as you want..7 to start, and then adding.

So, todays system would not allow you to get day 1 to 3 and then get shut out if you are booking at 11 months, whether you are walking or not.

The old system did which could be why it was changed.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Not correct. Todays system guarantees that if you can get day 1, you can get as many continuous nights as you want..7 to start, and then adding.

So, todays system would not allow you to get day 1 to 3 and then get shut out if you are booking at 11 months, whether you are walking or not.

The old system did which could be why it was changed.

Yeah, but with walking you may not get day 1.
That was my point. If it’s so popular that you can’t get it day by day at 8:00 am, it’s probably gone due to walking anyway.

 

[Sandisw]

Yeah, but with walking you may not get day 1.

True, but under the old system, you might not get it either. No matter the system, first come first serve means someone gets it snd someone doesn’t.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

True, but under the old system, you might not get it either. No matter the system, first come first serve means someone gets it snd someone doesn’t.

But at least on the first eligible day to book the room, 100% of the rooms were available. That does not happen with walking.

 

[zavandor]

Let's make an example.

There are 10 highly desirable rooms available and 100 members want to book one full week.

Old system:
Day one
10 people get it.

Day two.
On average, 1 person who got day one will get day 2 too, the other 9 won't get it and 9 new people will get day 2 only

Day three
The person who got days 1 and 2 has only 10% change of getting day 3 too. On average only one of the people who got day 2 will get day 3 too. One who got day one will get day three but has a night missing in the middle. A few people will now have just day 3.

Day 4
The chances for someone getting all 4 days are 0.1%. More new people get just one night. Maybe one got days 3 and 4. More and more have two or three not consecutive nights

Day 5
Situation getting worst. The chances that someone has 5 nights are 0,01%
Everyone is desperate as they get only a night here and there. They probably log in the DISboards to blame walkers anyway.

Day 6.
Chances of getting all 6 nights are now 0,001%
People start selling DVC.

Day 7
Chances of someone getting all 7 nights are 0,0001%. Which can be easily rounded to zero.


Current system.
Day one.
10 people have a reservation for day 1 and for the remaining 7 days. Some or even all of them may have walked the reservation.

Day 2 to 7. No room is available because they are all already booked.


Results.
Old system: no one got what they wanted. 100% unhappy people.
New system: 10 people got what they wanted, which is the actual maximum possible, since there are 10 rooms. No split stay. 90 unhappy people.


I understand that people may feel unfair if one or more of the 10 people walked the reservation, shutting out others. But yet, with the old system no one would have gotten it. I cannot see how this would be better.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Let's make an example.

There are 10 highly desirable rooms available and 100 members want to book one full week.

Old system:
Day one
10 people get it.

Day two.
On average, 1 person who got day one will get day 2 too, the other 9 won't get it and 9 new people will get day 2 only

Day three
The person who got days 1 and 2 has only 10% change of getting day 3 too. On average only one of the people who got day 2 will get day 3 too. One who got day one will get day three but has a night missing in the middle. A few people will now have just day 3.

Day 4
The chances for someone getting all 4 days are 0.1%. More new people get just one night. Maybe one got days 3 and 4. More and more have two or three not consecutive nights

Day 5
Situation getting worst. The chances that someone has 5 nights are 0,01%
Everyone is desperate as they get only a night here and there. They probably log in the DISboards to blame walkers anyway.

Day 6.
Chances of getting all 6 nights are now 0,001%
People start selling DVC.

Day 7
Chances of someone getting all 7 nights are 0,0001%. Which can be easily rounded to zero.


Current system.
Day one.
10 people have a reservation for day 1 and for the remaining 7 days. Some or even all of them may have walked the reservation.

Day 2 to 7. No room is available because they are all already booked.


Results.
Old system: no one got what they wanted. 100% unhappy people.
New system: 10 people got what they wanted, which is the actual maximum possible, since there are 10 rooms. No split stay. 90 unhappy people.


I understand that people may feel unfair if one or more of the 10 people walked the reservation, shutting out others. But yet, with the old system no one would have gotten it. I cannot see how this would be better.

If you’re talking about the old system, you truly have no understanding how it works.

If you’re not talking about the old system, I have no clue what you are saying.

 

[zavandor]

If you’re talking about the old system, you truly have no understanding how it works.

If you’re not talking about the old system, I have no clue what you are saying.

It seems you don't have any idea of how the old system was really used.
If a room is in such high demand, everyone would book day by day. If they don't then they have no chance.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

It seems you don't have any idea of how the old system was really used.
If a room is in such high demand, everyone would book day by day. If they don't then they have no chance.

I have booked the hardest reservations ever under the old system for many years.

From your scenario, it’s obvious you don’t have a fundamental grasp how the system works. What you said is just flat out wrong.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

It seems you don't have any idea of how the old system was really used.
If a room is in such high demand, everyone would book day by day. If they don't then they have no chance.

But even if a room was in such high demand that day by day was necessary, that room would have been walked long beforehand under the new system.
At least with the old system a Member couldn’t cheat by walking.

 

[zavandor]

I have booked the hardest reservations ever under the old system for many years.

From your scenario, it’s obvious you don’t have a fundamental grasp how the system works. What you said is just flat out wrong.

I have booked AKV value and BWV standard twice. BLT standard once. BCV once. All at 7 months, go figure. Your and mine anedoxtical experience count nothing.
Also, competition at 11 months has increased.
I started reading the DVC forums in 2011 and bought in 2012. At the time no one used to walk.
Your anedoctical experience with the old system, abandoned years ago, before some situations became critical (for just few rooms), count nothing.

 

[zavandor]

At least with the old system a Member couldn’t cheat by walking.

Booking day by day with the intention of booking one week is as cheating as walking.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

I have booked AKV value and BWV standard twice. BLT standard once. BCV once. All at 7 months, go figure. Your and mine anedoxtical experience count nothing.
Also, competition at 11 months has increased.
I started reading the DVC forums in 2011 and bought in 2012. At the time no one used to walk.
Your anedoctical experience with the old system, abandoned years ago, before some situations became critical, count nothing.

Whatever. You’re saying my experience with the old system means nothing.
Okay.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Booking day by day with the intention of booking one week is as cheating as walking.

No it’s not. Day by day booking you actually intend to stay there during that day, vs using it as a place holder and denying other members of the reservation.

Totally different.

 

[Sandisw]

But at least on the first eligible day to book the room, 100% of the rooms were available. That does not happen with walking.

Technically that Is true now if you count the first 7 days as those all open for booking the same time. That has nothing to do with walking.

Back then, you had to book daily if you wanted to ensure a room. Now, you get to book 7 nights at once, but every owner has the ability to do that.

I will agree though that day by day booking stops walking because it’s check out and not check in, but it does not make it any fairer as those that didn’t book day by day could get shut out...just like now.

 

[zavandor]

Whatever. You’re saying my experience with the old system means nothing.
Okay.

It doesn't because otherwise my experience of booking AKV value at 7 months would mean there is no need to walk. One person anedoctical experience is not important. The general picture is.

 

[Sandisw]

No it’s not. Day by day booking you actually intend to stay there during that day, vs using it as a place holder and denying other members of the reservation.

Totally different.

I bet some booked nights they didn’t want or need and ended up changing too,

It was definitely is a different system and obviously, wit’s the exception of walking, it sounds like it would be a nightmare today.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Technically that Is true now if you count the first 7 days as those all open for booking the same time. That has nothing to do with walking.

Back then, you had to book daily if you wanted to ensure a room. Now, you get to book 7 nights at once, but every owner has the ability to do that.

I will agree though that day by day booking stops walking because it’s check out and not check in, but it does not make it any fairer as those that didn’t book day by day could get shut out...just like now.

Not really. Just like under the new system if you chose not to walk, you are counting on those days to be available for the days you need. A good assumption for most dates and room types.

Under the old system you could make the same assumption and wait until 11 months from your checkout day and book in reverse. Again, a feasible assumption of availability for most situations.
Day by day was never a requirement, but rather just an option for the hard to get reservations. Today’s system people walk. Old system people booked day by day. Difference is day by day everyone has an equal shot.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

It doesn't because otherwise my experience of booking AKV value at 7 months would mean there is no need to walk. One person anedoctical experience is not important. The general picture is.

I never said there is no need to walk with today’s system. I’m simply saying the old system will fairly eliminate walking.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

I bet some booked nights they didn’t want or need and ended up changing too,

It was definitely is a different system and obviously, wit’s the exception of walking, it sounds like it would be a nightmare today.

Plans do change, but not intentionally. There would be no reason to do so under the old system.

 

[Sandisw]

Not really. Just like under the new system if you chose not to walk, you are counting on those days to be available for the days you need. A good assumption for most dates and room types.

Under the old system you could make the same assumption and wait until 11 months from your checkout day and book in reverse. Again, a feasible assumption of availability for most situations.
Day by day was never a requirement, but rather just an option for the hard to get reservations. Today’s system people walk. Old system people booked day by day. Difference is day by day everyone has an equal shot.

Walkers have the same chance as all the other walkers now, and day by day had the same chance as alll the other day by day. back then,

In the old system, if you didn’t do day by day for hard to get rooms and waited until your real check out day, you could lose out,

In the new system, if you wait to the 11 month plus 7 day for your actual check in date you could lose out,

Both system has people who find a way around the guidelines. We will agree to disagree that the new system is a better one than the old