Am I the only one who thinks Genie+ is not worth it?

[DLgal]

maybe I’m missing something, but doesn’t your guess of 3-4 rides on Genie+ equal the $5 per ride you’re willing to pay? I get you could ride the same ride 4 times via your preference, but cost is similar.

Yes, you are missing the point. If I am going to spend $20 either way, wouldn't it be better if I could choose how exactly I want to use it? Maybe I'd like to ride Space Mountain 4 times. My point is that at the price point WITH the restrictions, it holds no appeal to me. If there was a system that let you pay per ride and use however you want, as long as there is capacity in the LL, that would be FAR more appealing. And I'd be more apt to throw $5 out here and there to access a LL when the Standby line is too long and I'm feeling impatient. Right now, Disney is getting $0 from me for access to LL. And they will keep getting $0 under this current system. If they decided to open the LL up to pay per use, they would ABSOLUTELY get some $$$ from us.

 

[808blessing]

I loved Max Pass. That was the best!

 

[MonocularVision]

I feel Genie+ was designed more for the less frequent visitor. They may want to ride some attractions more than once, but more likely want to try and experience as many things as possible. Genie+ fits that. They may not be rope droppers or even know about that strategy and mosey into the parks around 10 or 11. For them Genie+ could have value. Would it save them the most amount of time and maximize the value? Probably not, but they might feel like it does.

I think this is spot on. It worked really well for us as visitors this last December coming from out of town. We aren’t big on opening the park so rolling in later in the day and buying G+ was fantastic. Saved us a lot of time and was really even better for us than MaxPass used to be, mainly because MP’s less restrictive nature meant times were usually way further out (if they were available at all) than they were with G+.

And since we were on a once-a-year, multi day trip we wanted more breadth and less “ride this ride a ton of times” action. And for the rides we wanted to reride, we would just wait for the end of the day when lines were almost empty.

 

[mommabo]

Yes, you are missing the point. If I am going to spend $20 either way, wouldn't it be better if I could choose how exactly I want to use it? Maybe I'd like to ride Space Mountain 4 times. My point is that at the price point WITH the restrictions, it holds no appeal to me. If there was a system that let you pay per ride and use however you want, as long as there is capacity in the LL, that would be FAR more appealing. And I'd be more apt to throw $5 out here and there to access a LL when the Standby line is too long and I'm feeling impatient. Right now, Disney is getting $0 from me for access to LL. And they will keep getting $0 under this current system. If they decided to open the LL up to pay per use, they would ABSOLUTELY get some $$$ from us.

No, I got your point. I was commenting on the equivalency of the money aspect. I even acknowledged the benefit of your preference is getting to chose one ride repeatedly. While we don’t repeat many rides, my daughter and I briefly lamented not easily being able to ride GOTG twice when we were there in December … but, on our visit, we found value in Genie+

My point was that Genie+, to me, seems geared more toward the infrequent visitor rather than AP holders. As an occasional AP holder, but not local, I miss MaxPass. I accept it’s day has come and gone. Now the public will decide if they move on with it or come to terms with the new iteration.

 

[gelatoni fan]

Yes, you are missing the point. If I am going to spend $20 either way, wouldn't it be better if I could choose how exactly I want to use it? Maybe I'd like to ride Space Mountain 4 times. My point is that at the price point WITH the restrictions, it holds no appeal to me. If there was a system that let you pay per ride and use however you want, as long as there is capacity in the LL, that would be FAR more appealing. And I'd be more apt to throw $5 out here and there to access a LL when the Standby line is too long and I'm feeling impatient. Right now, Disney is getting $0 from me for access to LL. And they will keep getting $0 under this current system. If they decided to open the LL up to pay per use, they would ABSOLUTELY get some $$$ from us.

Here's some math from economics 101:

Person A would pay $16 to skip the line for Space Mountain and $4 to skip the line for Indiana Jones. Person B would pay $16 to skip the line for Indiana Jones and $4 to skip the line for Space Mountain. Both people only care to ride Space Mountain and Indiana Jones each once per day. If sold separately, Disney would have to price both rides at $4 to get both people to buy both rides and make $16 but if they sold a Space Mountain + Indiana Jones bundle, both people would be willing to pay $20 for the bundle and Disney could make $40.

Now let's add person C who would pay $4 to skip the line for Space Mountain and wants to do Space Mountain twice but doesn't care about Indiana Jones. If Disney sold the rides separately at $4 as well as the bundle, only person B would buy the bundle at $20. Peron A would not buy the bundle because if Space Mountain only costs $4, they'd only be willing to pay up to $8 for a bundle. This means that in order to sell to person C, Disney would make only $20 by selling one bundle to person B and $12 from the three Space Mountain Fastpasses bought by A and C for $32 total. So Disney would not offer Space Mountain separately even though person C would be willing to pay for it. In this scenario, Disney thinks you're like person C.

Of course, we can tweak the numbers to make a different outcome. If person C was willing to pay $16 to skip Space Mountain, Disney could sell all the rides for $16 each. Then person A and person C would buy Space Mountain and person B would buy Indiana Jones for a total of four Fastpasses at $64.

In the scenario where person C values skipping the line for Space Mountain at $4, even changing the bundle to allow re-rides would not entice them because they wouldn't pay more than $8 to skip the line. But if person C valued Space Mountain at $10, Disney could offer a bundle that allowed re-rides and sell three bundles for a total of $60.

Of course, with thousands of guests and dozens of rides, the math is more complicated and Disney doesn't have perfect information on how much guests would be willing to pay to skip the line so precise math isn't even possible. It's definitely possible that the situation that makes the most money is one where the majority of guests think Genie+ is lousy value but a small subset pay for it. The dangerous thing about this is that if people see one thing offered by a company as overpriced and not worth buying, they're more likely to perceive other things by the company as overpriced and not worth buying. It's generally not a good idea to convince your most loyal customers that your products are not worth buying because if you do that long enough, many are going to decide not to be your customers anymore.

 

[Steven G]

In my mind, the only good thing about genie+ is that you don’t have to compete for a spot with the free fast pass users like you would for maxpass. Thus, in theory, you should be able to ride more rides using genie+, on average.

of course, since you can only ride a ride once per day using genie, that advantage is reduced.

I guess another advantage is that there is no annual pass option other than paying for it on each day, thus further reducing the number of people you are competing against for a time slot. Many see this as a negative of course.

otherwise, everything else to me is a negative compared to maxpass.

i dont Know why they don’t just use universal express pass model. That would be my preferred choice, and seems easier to maintain.

 

[disneychrista]

Pirates had fast pass at one point. It was removed several years ago, well before maxpass.

 

[starlite_]

Pirates had fast pass at one point. It was removed several years ago, well before maxpass.

Thank you! I feel like I'm going crazy but I def remember using paper fastpass on Pirates at some point.

Seems like most complains would be reduced if the limit was total uses instead of once per ride. That way ppl would be able to re-ride their favorites and not waste a "ticket" on things they won't/can't ride.

 

[DLgal]

Here's some math from economics 101:

Person A would pay $16 to skip the line for Space Mountain and $4 to skip the line for Indiana Jones. Person B would pay $16 to skip the line for Indiana Jones and $4 to skip the line for Space Mountain. Both people only care to ride Space Mountain and Indiana Jones each once per day. If sold separately, Disney would have to price both rides at $4 to get both people to buy both rides and make $16 but if they sold a Space Mountain + Indiana Jones bundle, both people would be willing to pay $20 for the bundle and Disney could make $40.

Now let's add person C who would pay $4 to skip the line for Space Mountain and wants to do Space Mountain twice but doesn't care about Indiana Jones. If Disney sold the rides separately at $4 as well as the bundle, only person B would buy the bundle at $20. Peron A would not buy the bundle because if Space Mountain only costs $4, they'd only be willing to pay up to $8 for a bundle. This means that in order to sell to person C, Disney would make only $20 by selling one bundle to person B and $12 from the three Space Mountain Fastpasses bought by A and C for $32 total. So Disney would not offer Space Mountain separately even though person C would be willing to pay for it. In this scenario, Disney thinks you're like person C.

Of course, we can tweak the numbers to make a different outcome. If person C was willing to pay $16 to skip Space Mountain, Disney could sell all the rides for $16 each. Then person A and person C would buy Space Mountain and person B would buy Indiana Jones for a total of four Fastpasses at $64.

In the scenario where person C values skipping the line for Space Mountain at $4, even changing the bundle to allow re-rides would not entice them because they wouldn't pay more than $8 to skip the line. But if person C valued Space Mountain at $10, Disney could offer a bundle that allowed re-rides and sell three bundles for a total of $60.

Of course, with thousands of guests and dozens of rides, the math is more complicated and Disney doesn't have perfect information on how much guests would be willing to pay to skip the line so precise math isn't even possible. It's definitely possible that the situation that makes the most money is one where the majority of guests think Genie+ is lousy value but a small subset pay for it. The dangerous thing about this is that if people see one thing offered by a company as overpriced and not worth buying, they're more likely to perceive other things by the company as overpriced and not worth buying. It's generally not a good idea to convince your most loyal customers that your products are not worth buying because if you do that long enough, many are going to decide not to be your customers anymore.

You lost me, sorry.

They could also offer both options, you know. That would make them even more money. Offer Genie+ and then sell access to the LL individually for all included rides. This way they capture EVERYONE who is willing to pay something to skip a line.

 

[DLgal]

I got a survey yesterday, mostly about Genie+. It seemed to imply that people don't know about it.

No, Disney. People just aren't choosing to buy it.

Oh, and the survey was triggered simply by making a park reservation, and there were a lot of questions about how I anticipated my visit being, with several "worse than in the past" and "more cumbersome than in the past" options presented as potential answers.

 

[SOCALMouseMommy]

In my mind, the only good thing about genie+ is that you don’t have to compete for a spot with the free fast pass users like you would for maxpass. Thus, in theory, you should be able to ride more rides using genie+, on average.

of course, since you can only ride a ride once per day using genie, that advantage is reduced.

The max potential is definitely less since you can only ride once per attraction per day. With Maxpass it was limitless.

 

[SOCALMouseMommy]

Seems like most complains would be reduced if the limit was total uses instead of once per ride. That way ppl would be able to re-ride their favorites and not waste a "ticket" on things they won't/can't ride.

That would definitely increase the value for me.

 

[mich311e]

I also loved Max Pass!

We had OK results with Genie+ in December over Christmas for 3 days. We did have some frustrations with rides going down and the LL not converting to ME.

I did think this was the best comparison I've seen so far.

I've also seen Dave from Fresh Baked do a couple of videos on Genie vs Standby. He has one video where he got through every attraction at DCA by about 1 in the afternoon.

My son and I are going next week and we basically have a day and a half (plus one quick morning visit the day we leave, but we usually don't try to hit a lot of attractions that day.) I plan on getting us Genie+ for our arrival half-day and full day. I'm interested to see how it goes for us this time. We don't get to come often and we like the big attractions, so it's worth the $20/ea for us to not spend 45 minutes in line for Space Mountain, Matterhorn, TSMM, Guardians, etc.

 

[Rich M]

its easy for me. My time is valuable and time is the one thing in life you will never get back ever. So if it cost me money not to waste my time then my time wins every time.

 

[whoever]

its easy for me. My time is valuable and time is the one thing in life you will never get back ever. So if it cost me money not to waste my team then my time wins every time.

This. My vacations are so few and far between that I spare no expense. I can't get my leisure time back, but I can always make more dollars..

 

[gelatoni fan]

You lost me, sorry.

They could also offer both options, you know. That would make them even more money. Offer Genie+ and then sell access to the LL individually for all included rides. This way they capture EVERYONE who is willing to pay something to skip a line.

That was one of the examples I mentioned. It's not necessarily true that offering both would lead to more money because some people who would have bought the more expensive Genie+ would choose to buy the cheaper individual LL instead. Disney gains money from all the customers who are willing to buy individual LL but loses money from people who no longer buy the expensive Genie+.

An example of that: Tom wants to pay $4 to skip the line for Space Mountain and Joe wants to pay $4 to skip the line for Indiana Jones. Mary wants to pay $10 to skip the line for Space Mountain and $10 to skip the line for Indiana Jones. If Disney sold Genie+ only, Mary would pay $20 for it. But if Disney also offered $4 individual LL, Mary would save money by buying those instead of Genie+. She would spend $8 total to skip the lines she wants to and Disney gets $8 from selling Lighting Lane to Tom and Joe which is a total of $16 and less than $20 from only offering Genie+ to Mary. More people are buying but Disney earns less money.

 

[DLgal]

That was one of the examples I mentioned. It's not necessarily true that offering both would lead to more money because some people who would have bought the more expensive Genie+ would choose to buy the cheaper individual LL instead. Disney gains money from all the customers who are willing to buy individual LL but loses money from people who no longer buy the expensive Genie+.

An example of that: Tom wants to pay $4 to skip the line for Space Mountain and Joe wants to pay $4 to skip the line for Indiana Jones. Mary wants to pay $10 to skip the line for Space Mountain and $10 to skip the line for Indiana Jones. If Disney sold Genie+ only, Mary would pay $20 for it. But if Disney also offered $4 individual LL, Mary would save money by buying those instead of Genie+. She would spend $8 total to skip the lines she wants to and Disney gets $8 from selling Lighting Lane to Tom and Joe which is a total of $16 and less than $20 from only offering Genie+ to Mary. More people are buying but Disney earns less money.

You are assuming people ONLY want to pay for 2 rides. That's not a likely scenario.

 

[WAstateDVCDaddy]

I also think if you want to pay extra to ride splash 5 times a day then that is fine, why 1 of each.

I think the issue is Disney’s in danger of losing its future attendance. If you make your first or second trip, or your once annual trip, it’s really disappointing to not be able to ride all your wish list rides. By providing an option to get in one ride of each major attraction, people feel they’ve gotten their moneys worth because they got to ride the rides they really wanted to, and will want to come back.

allowing multiple rides would mean the major rides would have long lines even for LL, and people would feel they didn’t get their moneys worth for either G+ or park attendance. And the standby lines for those rides would be longer, frustrating everyone.

I really miss MaxPass - we always got it and never felt it wasn’t worth the $15-20 daily. But we only visit 1-2x per year, and couldn’t run around collecting FP tickets with our DD in tow. (THAT would not be worth it! )

 

[Bossy22]

I just think it's a dumb system that they must be making less than they would of with a different option. As I've said numberous times, just being able to pay to use the fastpass machines (or maxpass for those who are digital) would have made everyone happier. I wish they didn't go to paid fast pass but they are a business. I would rather just another ticket price increase than paying for everything seperate. It's making it more complicated than it needs to be. People are going to get fed up with technology overall. I'm tired of it and haven't even tried it!!!

 

[Chickinvic]

its easy for me. My time is valuable and time is the one thing in life you will never get back ever. So if it cost me money not to waste my time then my time wins every time.

Me too. I don't get to go often, I'm not local, so why would I want to waste a load of time in lines? I'm there for the rides too, so I'm not someone who is waiting around for parades or that kind of thing. I want to ride baby!