Anyone following the Aziz Ansari situation?

If the level of sexual activity, on a first date no less, has escalated beyond what a woman's comfortable with, the next step is to say "No Thanks", and yes, end the date and leave.
By staying, her non-verbal communication, which she claims is so vital, is giving the impression more is to come. It's very naive to think otherwise.

She could have been scared to leave, that is possible.

Some of the responses on this thread is yikes worthy. Yikes indeed.
 


I think there were mistakes on both sides. This is the epitome of a bad date. Perhaps he didn't read her non-verbal cues, however, she also didn't read his verbal and non-verbal cues. He went into the date looking for a hookup, and when it became apparent that one wasn't going to be further forthcoming, he put her in a cab and sent her home. She went into the date hoping to gain a famous boyfriend, and was willing to engage in a bit of a sexual encounter, hoping that it would be enough to entice him into being the romantic boyfriend she was dreaming about, and when that didn't happen, she decided to leave in the cab. Instead of doing what he did and writing it off to a bad encounter, she has now taken the opportunity that the current social environment has given her to publicize her bad date and see if she can capitalize on it and gain the fame that she was looking for. It has worked in some areas, and backfired in others.

This isn't totally his fault, and it isn't totally her fault, beyond her decision to go public with a horrible date. He was honest with her in what he was looking for out of the evening, and she didn't listen to that. She was ambiguous in her non-verbal cues to him, oral sex and getting naked is a pretty darn blatant non-verbal cue for a man, and when she said no, he stopped.
 
I’m still stuck at being completely naked and performing some very intimate acts on a first date.

I’m a dinosaur. I admit it. He acted like a jerk and frankly, so did she in a different way. But I’m not calling it sexual assault.

He had no “position” over her. He’s not her boss. He didn’t hold a gun to her head or a knife to her throat. He had no power to impact her finances, job etc. Hes a celebrity, that’s it.

I’m not blaming the victim because she’s not a victim. She’s a young woman who made a very bad choice on a date, probably based on his celebrity status.

Hopefully she’s learned her lesson about becoming too intimate too soon and being so bowled over by “celebrity” that she did a lot of stupid stuff.
 
So many weird things that I can't process. She really takes the time out to complain about the wine he chose (white instead of red)? The worst day of her life? And she is fussing that she would have rather had red? Big, gigantic eyeroll.

She allowed him to perform on her (can I say that) on a first date? Is this normal for a first date? But she welcomed it. Then she reciprocated. He didn't force her. He asked. She said yes with her actions.

The rest of the night seems bizarre, but she didn't say no. He seems creepy. She stayed and played his creepy game.

No means no. But you have to say no. It appears she was agreeable in staying. The minute she said she wanted to leave, he called her a car.

The next day she felt like she "had a bad date". She then text him “You ignored clear non-verbal cues".

A non verbal cue to him may have been she stayed, and stayed, and stayed. She didn't leave. If we are now wanting our dates to go on "non verbal cues", a lot can be left up to interpretation. But saying NO is the best way to go.

Or leave.
 
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"Grace says her friends helped her grapple with the aftermath of her night with Ansari. “It took a really long time for me to validate this as sexual assault,” she told us."

She wanted him to read her "non verbal cues". Well, giving and receiving oral sex willingly is a non verbal cue that most would take as "I'm all in for this!"

It breaks my heart and hurts my brain for women that truly are assaulted.
 
I’m not blaming the victim because she’s not a victim. She’s a young woman who made a very bad choice on a date...

And then regretted it the next day. Has it come to this? Are we now calling regret "sexual assault"? Then she gathered her friends to help her write a text. They helped her realize she was assaulted. She then went to a reporter to smear this man's name. Is he a weirdo? Oh yes he is! But she went along with it.

And I agree, there is no victim here. She didn't say no. She didn't leave. She stayed and participated.
 
According to the account I read, he took her clothes off.

Yes, I’m the heat of the moment (where she seemed to be a wiling participant). She then stayed naked hanging out around the apartment and watching tv on the couch. In her account she got up to go to the restroom at least once and still didn’t put her clothes back on. To me, that’s sending mixed messages. If you’re uncomfortable, put your clothes on and say you need to leave. You don’t lounge around nude and continue making out.
 
I think things like this weaken the #metoo movement & are both ridiculous & offensive to those women (& men) who have been victims of true sexual assault.

Regretting what you did the night before does not equal sexual assault. And I feel sorry for men when women can turn around the next day & claim "sexaul assault" because they feel regret for what happened.

Sometimes in life, we make bad choices or do things we regret later, but we still have to live w/ the consequences & accept personal responsibility for the choices we make.

I understand feeling "pressured" & feeling like, if you don't do something, the other person may not like you or won't want to see you again... especially in a "OMG! I'm w/ a celebrity!" type situation. And that may be true, but, at the end of the day, what you do w/ your body is still up to you. Unless it really is sexual assault, you can choose to say no and/or leave.
 
I read an article that stated she pursued his phone number while on a date with someone else.

I don't know about any of you but I would think that might also have sent a signal to him that she was not looking for a wait til the third date type thing.

I agree with those who think this was a bad date that got built up to an assault in her mind by her friends.

I also am curious about the fact that she doesn't elucidate what her no verbal clues were.
 
Anyone remember the discussion over the #metoo around when it first came out and a poster said no one has ever falsely claimed assault or something like that? I wonder who that was and if they're keeping up with this story.
 
She allowed him to perform oral on her and reciprocated on him. She remained naked in his apartment. I'm sorry but you don't get to cry that you felt uncomfortable with that, it is all on you. He didn't force her to do any of that, she made a choice, a few choices, on her own. She is responsible for her acting on her own feelings. She decided to stay...still naked.
She blames him for not paying attention to her non verbal cues that she doesn't want to hook up, yet she doesn't take any responsibility for the non verbal cues she gave him that said "yes lets hook up". She is playing a victim but she is hardly one.

And the pp who mentioned this was a first date, I didn't even think of that. She goes that far on a first date? Then expects him to know she doesn't want to take it further?
I'm sure he thought it was nothing more than a hook up, her actions certainly play like it was.
 
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Am I the only one on this thread feeling gross about them sitting naked on the couch?

I hope there was a blanket or cover or something...:rolleyes1
 
I also am curious about the fact that she doesn't elucidate what her no verbal clues were.

It seems like she just wasn’t really that attracted to him and wasn’t really turned on (either by his behavior or his “techniques”) and she thought he should just be able to notice how she felt (even though her actions and participation indicated otherwise).

I know I already mentioned the wine thing, but to me it seems very revealing of her personality. Somehow he should have just “known” that she prefers red wine. It seems so self-centered to me. Maybe all he had on hand was white? If you don’t like white wine, you just say “no thanks”. You don’t drink it and then gossip about what a bad host someone is because they didn’t have your (a complete stranger’s) beverage of choice to offer. I suppose he should have been able to read her “non-verbals” and see that she didn’t like the wine she willingly accepted and drank. :rolleyes:

I just can’t possibly fathom going to someone’s house, them offering me a Coke and then being offended because I prefer Pepsi. I have a wine allergy, but tons of people drink wine. It would never cross my mind to be upset that someone didn’t have an alternative alcoholic beverage on hand just for me.

Am I the only one on this thread feeling gross about them sitting naked on the couch?

I hope there was a blanket or cover or something...:rolleyes1

I actually did think the same thing.
 
I’ve read his book and the way you’d expect the author of it to behave on a first date is very different from the way he behaved assuming her account is true.
 
UPDATE: The woman has come out at told her real name.

Apparently she was "shopping the story around for months before finally reaching Katie Way at Babe.net".

She tweeted "The fact the media is downplaying this assault and is now attacking me instead of supporting me is evidence of the work left to be done in naming and shaming predatory male sexuality."

Assault? Predatory?

http://thoughtforyourpenny.com/cult...-woman-accused-aziz-ansari-sexual-misconduct/
 

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