Long Timers...Has it been easy to rent unused points over the years?



Probably won't be an issue unless / until the spread between renting and Disney cash prices gets a lot smaller, or the economy weakens enough to stop people from wanting to go to Disney.
 
Probably won't be an issue unless / until the spread between renting and Disney cash prices gets a lot smaller, or the economy weakens enough to stop people from wanting to go to Disney.
Did you recall seeing this happen in 2001/2002? I remember tourism/economy in general took a big hit post 9/11. Or 2008/2009? Does anyone remember what rentals were like then? I know the rental market in general wasn't as robust then, but did you see a dip in prices or anything during the economic downturns?
 


Probably won't be an issue unless / until the spread between renting and Disney cash prices gets a lot smaller, or the economy weakens enough to stop people from wanting to go to Disney.
I just rented some of my Grand CA points. When I saw what the renters are paying, especially compared to rack, I thought, "why the heck do I own???"
 
Did you recall seeing this happen in 2001/2002? I remember tourism/economy in general took a big hit post 9/11. Or 2008/2009? Does anyone remember what rentals were like then? I know the rental market in general wasn't as robust then, but did you see a dip in prices or anything during the economic downturns?

Robust? It didn't really exist.

:earsboy: Bill

 
Did you recall seeing this happen in 2001/2002? I remember tourism/economy in general took a big hit post 9/11. Or 2008/2009? Does anyone remember what rentals were like then? I know the rental market in general wasn't as robust then, but did you see a dip in prices or anything during the economic downturns?
Agree with Bill - Don't recall that there even was a rental market back then - I'm sure there was, but it really wasn't talked about much (if at all) on the various internet discussion boards. I don't even recall much talk about resale. I knew it existed, but when we bought in 1999, the only on site DVC resorts were OKW & BWV.

For a long time, the going rate for rentals seemed to be stuck around $7. Disney was doing some pretty heavy-duty discounting to fill rooms. Rental rates really didn't budge much until the brokers got going.
 
I have rented our points at BWV and SSR on and off for the past 8 years without a problem. I have done it privately through these boards, as well as through David's Rentals.
 
20 year member .. we've rented points throughout the years .. just depended upon what we needed personally. We have had no problem finding people who are interested in renting, so we've always done privately. For years, we rented at $10, but just recently raised to $13. We have OKW and BWV, but we only rent the OKW points. Never had a problem, always go over DVC 30 day cancellation rules and what my points banking window is, and from there they can work out a payment plan that works for them, with the understanding paid in full/no refund prior to our cancellation or banking window depending upon the dates of their reservation. Never had anyone need to cancel.
 
Prior to brokers getting into the business, points usually rented for $10 a point with some about to expire points going for less. Now you pay $16 or $17 a point to rent through a broker, so individual owners are asking the same or close to that. As dues go up and owners or brokers raise their prices, it won't be a big a selling point for those wanting to rent. It will cost more to rent than to book with a discount.
 
Prior to brokers getting into the business, points usually rented for $10 a point with some about to expire points going for less. Now you pay $16 or $17 a point to rent through a broker, so individual owners are asking the same or close to that. As dues go up and owners or brokers raise their prices, it won't be a big a selling point for those wanting to rent. It will cost more to rent than to book with a discount.

This assumes that cash prices don't similarly rise. I think it is safe to say that Disney hasn't been lax about raising prices every year. As a result, I believe the spread between cash price and rental price will track similarly.

As to the implied suggestion that brokers are the cause of rental prices going up...hogwash. The primary driver of rental prices are the maintenance fees. When points were renting at $10, maintenance fees were typically $4 per point (i.e., rental prices 2.5 times the maintenance fees). As maintenance fees have gone up, with many now in the $6 per point range, rental prices have risen at the same proportion (2.5 * $6 = $15). Brokers have expanded the marketplace for points, and get a fee for handling the transaction. However, there are plenty of points available from private owners at $15 or less here on disboards. So, while you might pay more to rent through a broker than direct, it isn't required for you to do so.
 
Unused points? I am not familiar with the concept.

(I started with a small contract so that it would be easy to sell if I decided I had made a mistake.)
 
....(snip)....... The primary driver of rental prices are the maintenance fees. When points were renting at $10, maintenance fees were typically $4 per point (i.e., rental prices 2.5 times the maintenance fees). As maintenance fees have gone up, with many now in the $6 per point range, rental prices have risen at the same proportion (2.5 * $6 = $15). Brokers have expanded the marketplace for points, and get a fee for handling the transaction. However, there are plenty of points available from private owners at $15 or less here on disboards. So, while you might pay more to rent through a broker than direct, it isn't required for you to do so.
Respectfully disagree. IMO, the primary driver is demand and the growth of the internet discussion forums such as the DIS. The general public has become a lot more informed about the rental market and the ability to stay in villas for about the same price as a moderate.

The brokers helped spread the word & educate the public. They also provide an escrow service to alleviate some of the concerns re getting scammed. Much of the demand will not gravitate to private rentals due to that concern.
 
is assumes that cash prices don't similarly rise. I think it is safe to say that Disney hasn't been lax about raising prices every year. As a result, I believe the spread between cash price and rental price will track similarly

The parking fee could help too (avoiding by renting DVC). Granted it's a small percentage of the overall room rate, but having any garbage fee waived is always a psychological victory in addition to saving a few bucks.

They also provide an escrow service to alleviate some of the concerns re getting scammed.

I think that's a HUGE factor. It's a lot of money to send to an unknown person to rent points.
 
Respectfully disagree. IMO, the primary driver is demand and the growth of the internet discussion forums such as the DIS. The general public has become a lot more informed about the rental market and the ability to stay in villas for about the same price as a moderate.

The brokers helped spread the word & educate the public. They also provide an escrow service to alleviate some of the concerns re getting scammed. Much of the demand will not gravitate to private rentals due to that concern.
Agreed! I think it even starts on property hotel prices. You start with what a moderate/deluxe hotel prices. The rental market will rise with those prices, but always be lower because of cancellation terms, ease/availability of reservations/points, dealing directly with Disney, maid service, and other reasons. The direct rental market will be lower than the rental company market because of escrow service, availability and scammers. In general, the only offerings you see substantially lower then the $13-$14 7 month booking window offered by the rental companies are distressed points, which the brokerages won't pay $13-$14 for.

But overall, as Disney raises room prices, the rental companies raise their prices to customers, so they raise what they pay, so the prices go up on the boards.
 
Didn't the brokers raise the rates they paid for points last year because there weren't enough points available for the demand they were seeing?

At the end of the day, the rental market is driven by Disney cash prices. In general renters are looking for a 50% discount on the Disney cash price to make up for the risk and cancellational/change policies that most rentals have.

While it is nice that rental rates have been going up along with MF, MF do not drive rental rates. Now one would hope that the increase in MF stays in line with the increase in cash rates since they are essentially the same types of costs. But wait till the next recession and if Disney reduces their cash rates, rental rates will follow right along.
 

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