Masks Provide More Protection Against Covid-19 Than A Vaccine

I bought a few "very nice" cloth masks. No thanks. They are gross. IMO I will stick with disposables.
I prefer my cloth ones for everyday usage but there are times where the disposable ones feel better. I got a haircut back in late August and I wore a disposable one there, we've worn them when we've been outside for an extended time in heat (which this year thankfully wasn't that bad).

I wash my cloth ones regularly though, maybe that makes a difference? IDK. I also store mine in a plastic bag (each mask is separated from each other) so when I take it off say for instance at a table it goes in the bag so it doesn't get dirty in that sense.

My in-laws on the other hand use disposable ones but they don't really..dispose of them after every usage (I'd count a day as a usage) and it seems like they use it over and over and they don't have a bag for them, they set them on the table, on the seat, bunched up in their hands. IDK I find that makes me feel gross.

To me with all this mask business is people gotta find what works for them and that's not really easy IMO so I can sympathize with the preferences. The first mask we made for me didn't really work out, the fabric was way too thick. The masks relatives got us were way too big for me (and I knew they would) so I know I can't really get "one size" or "adult size" masks. We did end up getting these metal strips that you just stick onto your cloth ones and that has helped with the nose bridge part.
 
This isn't entirely new thinking. Early on, when Italy and China were the epicenter, there was some theorizing about the role infectious dose plays in the severity of illness, based mostly on the fact that health care professionals were having more severe cases and higher fatality rates than would be expected for their age and health. And I've read some opinions suggesting that it might play a role in our declining hospitalization and death rates now, even though case numbers are still high and the virus is pretty widespread (although the changing age profile of the infected is thought to factor into that as well). It is promising that serious research is now supporting the idea, but I doubt we'll see it have much effect on our national response. People are too entrenched in their perspectives by now, whether that perspective is "masks are worthless" or "we need to stay shut down" and aren't likely to change in response to a single piece of new information.
There is an article coming out in JAMA about this theory by Dr Monica Gandhi. She as been on USCf School of Med grand rounds Sept 10, 202 (on youtube) and fascinating interview with this fellow Dr.
This one is good for perspective
Precautions go a long way.

Everyone is deeply afraid of flying right now but airline employees are testing positive at half the rate of the general population.

https://www.businessinsider.com/airline-workers-covid-rates-is-flying-safe-2020-9
Remember when the media hyped the mass deaths predicted for grocery workers too? And teachers? and NONE have a greater risk than general population?

We must also get away from "herd immunity" being a "dirty word". Herd immunity can be achieved multiple ways and depends on each community and population. We ARE starting with herd immunity already with all the asymptomatic but not sick cases-generating an immune response so the virus will not be able to take hold again (at least for a while). THis is GOOD-masks help with that-keeping viral load low so no "sickness" but immune response generated so the virus cannot replicate again in that host.

Why on EARTH would anyone be "shocked" by this???

We MUST update thinking from MARCH data. Too many are still caught in the fear cycle (justified then) from March data when theres been millions more data since then. But some just really really really want to continue to be doom and gloom (mainly social media and news-this has been a HUGE boon to advertising click money!!!) Death rate-falling, Hospitalization-falling. Excessive deaths-at average August 23, BELOW average starting Aug 30th.
 
Can I say I do find it funny all the masks being hung from the rear view mirror....reminds of fuzzy Dice...tacky but masks hanging probably more gross 😂
 


My first question is, what behavior might they be trying to motivate? I'm guessing they're afraid once they start vaccinating *some* people, they are concerned lots of people will stop wearing masks, whether they have been vaccinated or not.
{{sigh}} Isn’t that the truth? Had we not been blatantly lied to in order to manipulate early on, we maybe now wouldn’t be so automatically suspicious. That particular genie simply will not go back in the bottle. :sad2:
I'm fairly certain that daily mask wearing will not lead to long-term breathing issues. However, contracting COVID most assuredly will.

Choose wisely.
...Thought to be honest I’m looking forward for the first day temps reach sub 0° and having a mask covering my face.
Not sure if maybe you’re joking but I have two words for you: frozen condensation. It’s going to be torture, actually.
 
I’m going to say the director of the cdc has a bit more insight on the vaccine then we as the general public do.

Not always! Depends on the appointed person. I have no faith in the DOE right now, for example.

Same. I hate spending all day at work feeling like I have to struggle for a deep breath. And I don't care if people say it's all in my head - it still feels that way.

What would your username do?

I don’t get the connection between wearing a bra to wearing a mask. As far as surgeons wearing masks for very long surgeries I’m sure they have ones that are a lot better then the flimsy paper ones we have to wear. They other day I had one thst felt like it was sprayed on the inside sort of like wall paper waste but not the heavy. As I was trying to breath it got even stickier and harder to breath.

Don't they wear the same masks - paper ones? I'm thinking they don't wear reusable cloth ones!

So are large gatherings now allowed in the USA with no masks?

Depends on the politics, which can't be discussed here.
 


It probably depends where you are.

Where I am large gatherings are not allowed and masks are mandatory.

Pea-n-Me, just thought I'd ask this. You are in New Jersey, correct? Because I'm puzzled by something.

So my aunt has a friend that she's had since the 1960s. She's like 79 years old now. I tell you this only because I don't have a lot of information (getting it from my aunt). This friend lives in New Jersey and recently her granddaughter had a wedding. The invited 300 people and 150 were able to attend. The wedding ceremony was held indoors at a Catholic church and the reception was held outdoors. That sort of shocked me that this was allowed.

Anyhow, last week, the bride and two bridesmaids became sick with COVID. A few days later, the 79 y/o grandmother (my aunt's friend) became ill. They were still waiting for results from other people and notifying the guests at the wedding.

I was just shocked that this large of a gathering was allowed (late August). Any idea about that?
 
Pea-n-Me, just thought I'd ask this. You are in New Jersey, correct? Because I'm puzzled by something.

So my aunt has a friend that she's had since the 1960s. She's like 79 years old now. I tell you this only because I don't have a lot of information (getting it from my aunt). This friend lives in New Jersey and recently her granddaughter had a wedding. The invited 300 people and 150 were able to attend. The wedding ceremony was held indoors at a Catholic church and the reception was held outdoors. That sort of shocked me that this was allowed.

Anyhow, last week, the bride and two bridesmaids became sick with COVID. A few days later, the 79 y/o grandmother (my aunt's friend) became ill. They were still waiting for results from other people and notifying the guests at the wedding.

I was just shocked that this large of a gathering was allowed (late August). Any idea about that?
Not NJ, but I just declined an invite to my niece's shower and wedding all happening in the next month. I've counseled my elderly parents not to go, but will now pass this story along with the others I have shared. Shower is indoors (mask optional). Wedding and reception at least are outdoors, but just way too many variables for me to decide it's safe.
 
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Pea-n-Me, just thought I'd ask this. You are in New Jersey, correct? Because I'm puzzled by something.

So my aunt has a friend that she's had since the 1960s. She's like 79 years old now. I tell you this only because I don't have a lot of information (getting it from my aunt). This friend lives in New Jersey and recently her granddaughter had a wedding. The invited 300 people and 150 were able to attend. The wedding ceremony was held indoors at a Catholic church and the reception was held outdoors. That sort of shocked me that this was allowed.

Anyhow, last week, the bride and two bridesmaids became sick with COVID. A few days later, the 79 y/o grandmother (my aunt's friend) became ill. They were still waiting for results from other people and notifying the guests at the wedding.

I was just shocked that this large of a gathering was allowed (late August). Any idea about that?
Wow! Idk, I am in MA.
 
As for Asian countries wearing masks when they’re sick and out in public. Doesn’t it make more sense if your sick stay home. Also there is no way way to have people wear masks for the rest of their lives. That’s just unrealistic. I also feel in a few years there’s going to be a lot of people with breathing issues due to wearing masks all day. It can’t be good to breath in that same stinky air whether it’s your own germs or not. By the end of my work day I’m so tired just from trying to get air through the mask. It’s just such a sad sick world

At least in Japan, not only sick people wear masks. When it's flu season, lots of people wear masks to avoid getting the flu.

It sounds like you need a new type of mask if it's that hard to get air through. No lasting mask-related health issues were reported after the 1918 pandemic, and lots of people wore masks. The whole "I'm breathing in CO2 all day" thing is just incorrect, I know you didn't say that but I keep hearing others say it. We get plenty of O2 while wearing masks, many studies have been done that refute the CO2 claim.
 
He is saying that based on the usual way that vaccines work and their ability to give you immunity. What he was saying was that, if you get the vaccine, there is still a chance it won't work for you... a mask will always work for you if everyone is wearing them in public spaces.

Well and I have a good friend who is a nuclear biologist in one of the labs working on vaccines. The way he explained it to me, this virus has a still-unpredictable mutation pattern, and so getting a vaccine nailed down that provides the most protection possible is proving to be tough. The flu is similar, but we have reliable treatment for flu that reduces the number of folks who get severely ill. We don't have that reliable treatment yet as they are still studying how the virus impacts the body systems.

The CDC needs damage control now. They can’t come out with these claims without strongly supported science.

So here's the thing. this is a NOVEL virus. Nothing like this has ever been experienced in humans, and so what people perceive as the CDC switching their message all the time is really just the general public experiencing how science unfolds in real time. Because things happened so fast, we didn't have the luxury of waiting for the science community to thoroughly study and document the virus before informing the public. AND because we are such an instant-gratification culture, there was demand for information ASAP. There IS NO STRONGLY SUPPORTED SCIENCE yet - it is literally being learned before our eyes. And so yes, they will make statements based on what they know at the time, but continue to learn and research. And as they know more, that informs their recommendations. And no, I'm not just defending anyone - I literally have people in my friend circle who are scientists and analysts that have been working tirelessly on this since the beginning.

The way I took Redfield's comment was that the vaccine is not going to be super-effective. We won't get something like a measles vaccine. Even if we are "lucky" enough to get a 50% efficacy, we don't know how long it will last and how many people will even get enough antibodies. Based on that, everyone masking up is still better protection. It's a sad reality, but I prefer the honest, hard truth so I can mentally prep for it.

Yup, and per my above comment, it's not been an easy virus to get a handle on. the mutation patterns aren't consistent. They are still trying to find the proverbial "achilles heel" of the virus, that one thing in its coding that we can attack that shuts down the process.
 
Not NJ, but I just declined an invite to my niece's shower and wedding all happening in the next month. I've counseled my elderly parents not to go, but will now pass this story along with the others I have shared. Shower is indoors (mask optional). Wedding and reception at least are outdoors, but just way too many variables for me to decide it's safe.
We declined a wedding in Nebraska for that reason that occurred over Labor Day weekend. There were supposedly 150 people that RSVP'd. Wedding inside at a church with masks recommended but not required and who knows about the reception. Thankfully they had a FB Live feed of the church so we could watch it. Seeing it on camera (where some people wore masks while others did not) there didn't appear to be close to 150 people but still. I felt for the couple getting married (it was my husband's coworkers) but it just wasn't a good scenario really.

I also have been keeping up with that Maine wedding and yeah..

Father-in-law's wife's nephew just got engaged for a wedding in October of next year. That one will be at least several hundred people. I can't stop my mind from already thinking about it even though it's 13 months in the future.
 
We declined a wedding in Nebraska for that reason that occurred over Labor Day weekend. There were supposedly 150 people that RSVP'd. Wedding inside at a church with masks recommended but not required and who knows about the reception. Thankfully they had a FB Live feed of the church so we could watch it. Seeing it on camera (where some people wore masks while others did not) there didn't appear to be close to 150 people but still. I felt for the couple getting married (it was my husband's coworkers) but it just wasn't a good scenario really.

I also have been keeping up with that Maine wedding and yeah..

Father-in-law's wife's nephew just got engaged for a wedding in October of next year. That one will be at least several hundred people. I can't stop my mind from already thinking about it even though it's 13 months in the future.
I really think you'll be fine next October.

I get that young people want to get on with their lives, but I'll never forgive my brother if my parents go and get sick. If you're in that big a hurry, just go to the court house and have a giant reception next year.
 
Pea-n-Me, just thought I'd ask this. You are in New Jersey, correct? Because I'm puzzled by something.

So my aunt has a friend that she's had since the 1960s. She's like 79 years old now. I tell you this only because I don't have a lot of information (getting it from my aunt). This friend lives in New Jersey and recently her granddaughter had a wedding. The invited 300 people and 150 were able to attend. The wedding ceremony was held indoors at a Catholic church and the reception was held outdoors. That sort of shocked me that this was allowed.

Anyhow, last week, the bride and two bridesmaids became sick with COVID. A few days later, the 79 y/o grandmother (my aunt's friend) became ill. They were still waiting for results from other people and notifying the guests at the wedding.

I was just shocked that this large of a gathering was allowed (late August). Any idea about that?
Depending on the area, events can be held with attendance based on percentage of capacity. Depending on the size of a church, I can see 150 being able to attend (if the church seats 500+).
 
Well and I have a good friend who is a nuclear biologist in one of the labs working on vaccines. The way he explained it to me, this virus has a still-unpredictable mutation pattern, and so getting a vaccine nailed down that provides the most protection possible is proving to be tough. The flu is similar, but we have reliable treatment for flu that reduces the number of folks who get severely ill. We don't have that reliable treatment yet as they are still studying how the virus impacts the body systems.
Exactly.... I think he is trying to brace us for what is probably a vaccine that isn't the magic bullet. We need to use all the tools to help us get past this virus.
 
As for Asian countries wearing masks when they’re sick and out in public. Doesn’t it make more sense if your sick stay home.

In Asia, at least in Japan, the masks are for more than when you are sick. They are indeed used when the wearer has a cold, but they are also used to abate allergies or reduce spead of droplets when sneezing due to them as a courtesy and sometimes they are simply worn as a social signal to be left alone. It's similar to what wearing headphones means here. They basically don't want to start a conversation so many are very comfortable wearing them. Women especially seem to because there is a cultural taboo about showing their mouth open, like when they cover their mouth while laughng or eating.

I can totally see masks sticking around in the west for people who are sick, like just a cold or something. It'll be few and far between, but it won't be abnormal to see a person or two in a store with one on.
 
So are large gatherings now allowed in the USA with no masks?

Most states' restrictions exempt certain activities that are protected by the First Amendment. So political rallies, protests, and in many states, religious services aren't subject to the same rules that other events and gatherings are.
 

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