Permit Filed: France Pavilion at Epcot

[FoxC63]

This could be the expected Ratatouille attraction. 5.7 acres behind and next to the France Pavilion:
http://my.sfwmd.gov/entsb/docdownload?object_id=0900eeea89b856f9

Still reading through it...
2.0 Project Site Description
The 5.70 acre project in Epcot consists of adding impervious surface. Stormwater from the site
discharges through existing conveyance pipe to the RCID Epcot Master Drainage System.
3.0 Proposed Project
This project proposes additional impervious surface. Stormwater treatment will be provided by the
construction of two new dry detention ponds that outlet to the RCID EPCOT

View attachment 246679

Thanks OP for keeping us informed!

 

[crazy4wdw]

I am really excited about this development! I was skeptical that the Ratatouille attraction would be developed.

 

[DanBoris]

I hope it's Ratatouille. One of my absolute favorites! Judging from the YT vids, it would be awesome if they did something like DLP.

It is Rat, it will be the same ride as the one in DLP.

 

[Boski]

Lets just hope they get it built quick. Epcot need some TLC and this is a good start.

 

[rteetz]

Lets just hope they get it built quick. Epcot need some TLC and this is a good start.

2019

 

[DisneyFansInNYC]

This is great - EPCOT definitely needs some help.

 

[amberpi]

My little nephew's name is Remy, so I'm stoked for this. I don't think my brother even knew he was naming his son after a rat

 

[Lesverts]

I guess but frozen doesn't really represent Norway in anyway.

And that is the biggest thing. The author was Danish and the original story was loosely based in Copenhagen and Denmark.

Using IP that have clear story or historical connections to any one of the pavilions is a bit different. I can think of IP for France, Germany, Italy, the United Kingdom, USA, Mexico, China and maybe Japan that would fit. Not entirely sure how I feel about Big Hero Six as a representative of Japan. That leaves Canada, Morocco and Norway as countries without concrete Disney related IP. Honestly if they wanted to they could put a water ride into Canada and it would fit.

Frozen and Norway just seem off. But the deed is done and we have to live with it. Let us hope that any additions to the other pavilions are worth the wait and anticipation.

 

[SaintsManiac]

This is such great news. Epcot is my favorite and it needs this badly.

 

[Lee Matthews]

I hope they announce and work on the ride in the UK Pavilion too at the same time

 

[Dfan79]

Me want, me want. I've been craving me some Rat for sometime now. Ever since I first saw the one in France I've told myself "Someday I will have it."

They definitely will need to open all of World Showcase at 9 am, if it happens. This will definitely help with the huge crowds. They'll be different hordes of humans going to Test Track, Soarin, Frozen and now Ratatouille.

It will be Awesome.

 

[HydroGuy]

Frozen doesn't exactly scream Norway though.

I guess but frozen doesn't really represent Norway in anyway.

Because I know already you are well informed, you must mean something different than I think you mean.

The researchers and artists who worked on Frozen traveled to Norway and liberally incorporated Norwegian folk art into the film. The scenery was lifted from Western Norway. If you mean Arendelle is not literally in Norway, well yes. But more so than many of the Disney princess movies, Frozen represents a specific country. To me the link between Frozen and Norway is extremely strong.

http://britsketch.blogspot.com/2014/01/frozen-rosemaling.html
http://www.nordivatours.com/blog/frozen-scenery/

 

[Dfan79]

Because I know already you are well informed, you must mean something different than I think you mean.

The researchers and artists who worked on Frozen traveled to Norway and liberally incorporated Norwegian folk art into the film. The scenery was lifted from Western Norway. If you mean Arendelle is not literally in Norway, well yes. But more so than many of the Disney princess movies, Frozen represents a specific country. To me the link between Frozen and Norway is extremely strong.

He is intelligent and knows what he said.

I don't care where they went. If I went to the moon and came back and then made my version of the moon out of mash potatoes, it's not the same thing. Each of the countries except Norway are complete recreations of real buildings and landmarks.

Many of the things depicted in the pavilion and on the ride are works of fiction. I can live with the characters, but there is no hint of the real Norway in the pavilion's attraction or store.

This should be in Fantasyland not Norway.

 

[HydroGuy]

He is intelligent and knows what he said.

I don't care where they went. If I went to the moon and came back. And then made my version of the moon out of mash potatoes it's not the same thing. Each of the countries except Norway are complete recreations of real buildings and landmarks. Last time I checked many of the things depicted in the pavilion and on the ride are works of fiction.

It sounds like you are saying that the Norway pavilion at Epcot and the Frozen Ever After ride are not representative of the real Norway. That is far different than saying the Frozen movie has nothing to do with real country of Norway.

 

[Lvsdisney]

He is intelligent and knows what he said.

I don't care where they went. If I went to the moon and came back. And then made my version of the moon out of mash potatoes it's not the same thing. Each of the countries except Norway are complete recreations of real buildings and landmarks. Last time I checked many of the things depicted in the pavilion and on the ride are works of fiction.

Actually everything in the Norway pavilion, minus the Frozen stuff, is based on REAL landmarks. Bergen, Akershus in Oslo, and a Stave Church, which its style is found all over the country. They even believed (many years ago) that rocks turned into trolls. Their are definitely nods to Norway and its culture in Frozen, so I will give it that. But I don't personally don't like FEA in the pavilion since Arendelle is not a real place. I would rather Maelstrom come back. But that ship has sailed.

 

[Dfan79]

It sounds like you are saying that the Norway pavilion at Epcot and the Frozen Ever After ride are not representative of the real Norway. That is far different than saying the Frozen movie has nothing to do with real country of Norway.

If a place isn't real it doesn't belong in World Showcase pavilion, where the main goal is to showcase countries. I Love the ride, but all I see is the movie and fictional Arendelle when I go on the Frozen attraction. I do not get any feelings that I'm seeing a real country. It goes against everything World Showcase stands for.

In "Grand Fiesta" you see different parts of Mexico and get a feel for their customs. Sure it has characters like Frozen, but the characters and story are intertwined with the real Mexico. They didn't just create it because they have a new popular movie out.

Plus Mexico has a busy marketplace with authentic Mexican items. And both the marketplace and table restaurant overlook a fact based temple and river. It is really a beautiful pavilion that is not overly filled with IP Merchandise.

The whole pavilion makes you feel like you could be in Mexico.

 

[HydroGuy]

Actually everything in the Norway pavilion, minus the Frozen stuff, is based on REAL landmarks. Bergen, Akershus in Oslo, and a Stave Church, which its style is found all over the country. They even believed (many years ago) that rocks turned into trolls. Their are definitely nods to Norway and its culture in Frozen, so I will give it that. But I don't personally don't like FEA in the pavilion since Arendelle is not a real place. I would rather Maelstrom come back. But that ship has sailed.

If a place isn't real it doesn't belong in World Showcase pavilion, where the main goal is to showcase countries. I Love the ride, but all I see is the movie and fictional Arendelle when I ride the Frozen attraction. I do not get any feelings that I'm seeing a real country. It goes against everything World Showcase stands for.

In "Grand Fiesta" you see different parts of Mexico and get a feel for their customs. Sure it has characters like Frozen, but the characters and story are intertwined with the real Mexico. They didn't just create because they have a new popular movie out.

Plus Mexico has a busy marketplace and table restaurant that overlook a temple and river. It actually makes you feel like you could be in Mexico.

I am curious about this line of thought and would like to understand it better. I am going to be a bit of a devil's advocate for a moment, and I make no claims to having an expert Disney trivia memory or geographic memory either. So I very well may have my facts wrong.

First, I have visited all the countries in World Showcase. Except for Norway and Morocco.

As far as the countries in WS, some of the pavilions seem solidly based on those countries. Other pavilions seem based on historical elements and not active parts of today.

Two examples. Italy and St. Mark's Square and Tower. The colors of the marble and look of this pavilion are squarely based on the real place today in Venice. So it fits your desire for "real places".

Next look at China. To see the type of architecture and garden in the China pavilion, one has to go in search of tourist areas that represent the China of centuries past. The Forbidden City and places like that. To me it does not fit your desire for "real places". It is real in the touristy real sense.

When I walk around Epcot, I see Snow White M&Gs at Germany. And a Snow White topiary during Flower & Garden. Did anything in that movie say it was Germany? I do not remember it. They certainly did not speak with German accents. To me it was a placeless fairy tale, even more so than Arendelle which intentionally is based on Norway.

Aladdin. Agrabah is not a real place. But there are Aladdin and Jasmine out in front of Morocco.

Mary Poppins and Peter Pan? Very clearly England as they say in each movie. Winnie the Pooh? I have no memory of that except that Christopher Robin speaks with a British accent. But I see Winnie the Pooh, Eeyore and others' topiaries there in the UK. I have not seen Winnie the Pooh M&Gs there but then I do not pay much attention to M&Gs.

I cannot remember but does Pinnocchio literally say it takes place in Italy? Or is it just the names of the characters that make us think that? I cannot remember for sure but are there Pinnocchio topiaries in front of Italy during F&G?

To me Disney clearly takes some of the fairy tale stories and makes associations with various countries and promotes that within World Showcase.

Again, I am not looking for a big argument. In fact, I struggle a bit with Epcot and how it all fits within Disney more so than any of the other parks. So I would appreciate any insight on Epcot from folks like you here.



ETA: The Ratatouille movie is of course based clearly on France.

 

[Lvsdisney]

I am curious about this line of thought and would like to understand it better. I am going to be a bit of a devil's advocate for a moment, and I make no claims to having an expert Disney trivia memory or geographic memory either. So I very well may have my facts wrong.

First, I have visited all the countries in World Showcase. Except for Norway and Morocco.

As far as the countries in WS, some of the pavilions seem solidly based on those countries. Other pavilions seem based on historical elements and not active parts of today.

Two examples. Italy and St. Mark's Square and Tower. The colors of the marble and look of this pavilion are squarely based on the real place today in Venice. So it fits your desire for "real places".

Next look at China. To see the type of architecture and garden in the China pavilion, one has to go in search of tourist areas that represent the China of centuries past. The Forbidden City and places like that. To me it does not fit your desire for "real places". It is real in the touristy real sense.

When I walk around Epcot, I see Snow White M&Gs at Germany. And a Snow White topiary during Flower & Garden. Did anything in that movie say it was Germany? I do not remember it. They certainly did not speak with German accents. To me it was a placeless fairy tale, even more so than Arendelle which intentionally is based on Norway.

Aladdin. Agrabah is not a real place. But there are Aladdin and Jasmine out in front of Morocco.

Mary Poppins and Peter Pan? Very clearly England as they say in each movie. Winnie the Pooh? I have no memory of that except that Christopher Robin speaks with a British accent. But I see Winnie the Pooh, Eeyore and others' topiaries there in the UK. I have not seen Winnie the Pooh M&Gs there but then I do not pay much attention to M&Gs.

I cannot remember but does Pinnocchio literally say it takes place in Italy? Or is it just the names of the characters that make us think that? I cannot remember for sure but are there Pinnocchio topiaries in front of Italy during F&G?

To me Disney clearly takes some of the fairy tale stories and makes associations with various countries and promotes that within World Showcase.

Again, I am not looking for a big argument. In fact, I struggle a bit with Epcot and how it all fits within Disney more so than any of the other parks. So I would appreciate any insight on Epcot from folks like you here.

I think a lot of the character M&Gs and/or decorations that are in each country are due to either location of film OR who wrote the original story. Peter Pan, Mary Poppins, and Winnie the Pooh are all by English writers. Snow White is a German Fairy Tale. Pinocchio is by an Italian author. And Aladdin is from "One Thousand and One Nights" which is a collection of stories based in Middle Eastern areas (now Morocco is technically in Africa but it has strong Arabian/Islamic influence and thus, it sort of makes sense to have Aladdin and Jasmine there, though still a bit of a stretch). Now, even though they claim Frozen is based on Norwegian culture (very obvious) they story itself is not set in Norway and the original book, the Snow Queen, is actually written by a Dane. So, while it may seem strange to have all of the above characters do M&Gs in the respective countries, there is actually a tie-in. And I'm not against M&Gs in those countries, but I'm against replacing a ride that was actually a fun ride (at least IMHO) and overlaying it with an IP that doesn't actually take place in that country, vs building a brand new ride in MK for Frozen. I'm not against the Ratatouille ride because 1) the movie takes place in Paris (I would argue the city is a character of sorts) AND 2) it's not replacing a ride, but an actual new build.

 

[rteetz]

Because I know already you are well informed, you must mean something different than I think you mean.

The researchers and artists who worked on Frozen traveled to Norway and liberally incorporated Norwegian folk art into the film. The scenery was lifted from Western Norway. If you mean Arendelle is not literally in Norway, well yes. But more so than many of the Disney princess movies, Frozen represents a specific country. To me the link between Frozen and Norway is extremely strong.

http://britsketch.blogspot.com/2014/01/frozen-rosemaling.html
http://www.nordivatours.com/blog/frozen-scenery/

I disagree. Sure there are some connections never in the movie is it said they are in Norway or near Norway. I believe they mention Scandinavian culture but to me that doesn't specifically mean Norway. I think Imagineering did a good job creating the facades of the attractions to look like Norway but that doesn't mean the movie or ride have a cultural link. There is nothing we can do about it now though. To me there is a clear connection between Ratatouille and France but not as clear with Frozen. With that said I'm a believer that IP isn't necessarily needed to make World Showcase better. Apparently I'm in the minority in that.

 

[rteetz]

He is intelligent and knows what he said.

I don't care where they went. If I went to the moon and came back. And then made my version of the moon out of mash potatoes it's not the same thing. Each of the countries except Norway are complete recreations of real buildings and landmarks.

Many of the things depicted in the pavilion and on the ride are works of fiction. I can live with the characters, but there is no hint of Norway in the pavilion's attraction or store.

This should be in Fantasyland not Norway.

Agreed. Frozen deserved an E-ticket in Fantasyland because of how successful it was. A $150 million or so redo of a ride not so much.