The Intersection of FIRE and Disney

[SouthFayetteFan]

I'm reading this and slightly jealous of y'all.

I became a single mom this year. In the divorce I kept the house, because truthfully I pay about the same on this mortgage as I would for a 2 bedroom apartment in our area. I got to take $9k in credit card debt as well (we split 50/50). It's kinda amazing, I've been flying solo on expenses since June. There used to be nearly an additional $100K in our budget...yet we lived paycheck to paycheck some months. And I was the one with the spending issue supposedly, LOL.

I'm a teacher with 20 lovely years in. I won't complain as I get paid kinda decent. I mean decent enough to keep floating the $300k house, the SUV, the travel sports, etc. But I am also not saving anything. All my "retirement" eggs are in the pension I have. I don't have any other retirement accounts. The kids have small 529's. I've ran the numbers, I'll have enough years/age to retire in 7 years....when my 13yo is in the midst of college and my 9yo is gearing up to enter as well. As much as I'd like to think he'll be getting a hockey scholarship, I'm sure we'll be paying. I think if I walk in 7 years and start to collect immediately I'm looking at $45k/yr.....which will likely be about 1/2 what I'm used to at the time. So it would be a HUGE adjustment. Of course there's always the option of getting some "fun" job to supplement expenses. I just wonder, knowing that I'm not able to really save right now (single income, and cutting costs where I can w/o punishing the kids, I'm not moving, I'm already in a super cheap SUV payment, etc), and I doubt save much in the future....is it even possible for me to figure out how to live on the $45k just as college expenses are coming up for both. If you know anything about teaching....well I'm shocked I made it 20 years, LOL....I teach HS!!!

Ideally once my son graduates I would be selling the house and downsizing. But I would likely stay in the area which is $$$, so not so sure on the cost savings there. I'd love to think I only have 7 years left in this nightmare, I mean chance to shape young people's lives.....(kidding most days I DO like it).

So this thread should be a bunch of friendly folks, but if you're looking for FIRE advice...there'd be a ton of tough love. This isn't directed at you so please don't take offense, but here's the FIRE advice you'd hear in your situation:

• Get rid of CC debt immediately, ALL discretionary spending is shut off completely until that's gone
• Sell the $300k house, downsize
• IF you have a long commute...Move somewhere closer to where you work to reduce commuting expense
• Sell the SUV to eliminate the payment and buy a less expensive car with all cash
• Find a way to cut expenses to actually save
• Don't quit your job in 7 years

You don't have to do any of these of course, lol. But this is what FIRE people would say if you wanted advice

 

[amalone1013]

I wish I had the restraint not to eat out. Also, I miss NY and ordering a $12 pizza on the weekend which would be enough for us for two meals. Also, $3 to get bagels. Now I can’t eat that stuff in VA. Lol we would also get Chinese for $20 in NY but I can’t eat that here either.

We typically do Panera or chipotle for about $20 a meal. Occasionally I’ll use my fun money and get fast food when I’m craving it.

I do like going to sit down restaurants tho too but we have cut back on this SO is prefers to be home after work so maybe we go to a sit down restaurant twice a month. It’s actually probably more than that I don’t want to look lol

And then I went back and saw this

Eating out is our single biggest challenge. We just have really different views on it, and I think it's funny because my family ate out a ton growing up, sit down 1-2 times a week, fast food a lot of nights, Saturday and Sunday lunches with my grandma and aunts every week. DHs family ate out rarely, even fast food... couple times a month total plus birthdays. And I'm tired of it a lot, plus it seems like all we have our chains around us and there were a lot of local places in my hometown. DH really likes going out, because they didn't go much. So we try to work out a balance. And right now we also usually cover in laws, which makes it even more... but covering them is less than rent.

Agreeg!! My theory on the car was that while paying ahead on my mortgage could've saved more at the time...completely eliminating a payment is awesome (especially when viewed in light of a temporary job loss or something along those lines). I can't go back to the mortgage company and say remember that extra money I paid 2 years ago...now I want to skip payments. But eliminating a $350 car payment means it is gone

That was a conversation DH and I had to have, only it was car payments vs student loans. At some point he wanted to switch to my car loan, and I had to show him the math that even if we had to stop paying extra on student loans after 6 months, our monthly payment would have gone down because we would have paid a couple more off. Vs with my car, that might move up the payoff date but at the end of the day... it would still be the same payment unless we could keep it up for 2 straight years at the time. Something like that.

 

[LilSweetPeaPhoto]

So this thread should be a bunch of friendly folks, but if you're looking for FIRE advice...there'd be a ton of tough love. This isn't directed at you so please don't take offense, but here's the FIRE advice you'd hear in your situation:

• Get rid of CC debt immediately, ALL discretionary spending is shut off completely until that's gone
• Sell the $300k house, downsize
• IF you have a long commute...Move somewhere closer to where you work to reduce commuting expense
• Sell the SUV to eliminate the payment and buy a less expensive car with all cash
• Find a way to cut expenses to actually save
• Don't quit your job in 7 years

You don't have to do any of these of course, lol. But this is what FIRE people would say if you wanted advice

I'm paying down the CC debt as much as I can each month. I have not added to it. I'm transferring around to 0%/$0 fees while I work on it. I could PIF as I have the money in savings, but as a single mom, that is my safety net. So while it's 0% interest, I'll be hanging onto the cash flow (the ex lost his job this fall and while I'm pretty certain I'd be able to find something if I did, flying solo, I really need the safety net).
Selling the $300k house is NOT an option. 1- likely still upside down on it. It's one of the reasons I kept it in the divorce. We would have paid out $20-30k. We refied the year before the divorce and took out all equity. We paid down some debt and then put in a new furnace, floors, etc. 2- $300k is close to the cheapest house in our area. My Ex moved into a condo .5 mile away. His condo was $150k, but his monthly payment after assoc fees is only like $200 cheaper. Apartments are $2500+/mo. My mortgage is $1700. The house ain't going, LOL. Plus we are staying close to each other in order to make this divorce as easy as can be for the kiddos. They ride the same bus, same school, etc.
I have the shortest commute I've ever had. It's about 15 min drive.
I know the car payment is always the suggested thing to go when looking at budgets. But in the Metro Detroit area....car/lease payment is just part of life. The good news is I DO get a discount, LOL. The way I look at it, the payment offsets any costs I have with upkeep as I'm ALWAYS under warranty on the cars I drive. I just know that for example, tires on my Jeep would have been $1k. I pay $290/mo right now. For that I get piece of mind that I don't have to worry about unexpected costs. Yes, I know that those who drive used normally have some kinda savings for those expenses.
I've cut our cable cost and cell phones. I've dumped my gym membership and my lawn service. I use coupons when I can, cut back tremendously on eating out, etc. I need to price shop our insurance more seriously but when I did earlier this fall, I have a pretty decent rate. My BF jokes if I can get $1 for something, I'm listing it and selling it on FB or ebay. I need to get more serious about doing that and purging the house, but so far this fall I've made a couple hundred selling off my son's old hockey skates, my daughter's hunter boots, snowboard boots, snow pants, etc. I list any/all clothes I can on Poshmark or take to the local consignment. If there is a penny to be made off something, I try to get it. I then use that money to either buy the new item, or offset costs (like Christmas).

And for your last one.....BUT teaching SUCKS! LOL. Kidding/not kidding.

 

[DisneyMandC]

@speedyfishy That's actually a really good price on rent for your area since it includes gas, water, and parking.

That being said... I pay less than that in mortgage, PMI, insurance, and property taxes for a home on 17 acres less than two hours south of you... LOL.

 

[alryan]

Thanks for the critique! My rent payment makes me so sad every month when I pay it. We are in a HCOL area and I just can’t seem to get it down. We looked at other options in the $1300 range and the places were dumps. Roaches etc I saw when touring them. I also can’t do roommates. I really want to move out of the area soon the rent is crazy here and I’m not in love with the area. The $1730 includes valet trash, parking and sewer, water and gas at least lol. I was thinking of buying a condo which would be a few hundred cheaper a month for the mortgage but we don’t want to stay here long term. We could also move further out but the traffic is insane and SO likes he can take the metro and be to work in 20 mins.

I like the idea of multiple savings accounts. We have discover and I’m going to reach out to see if we can set up a lot to do things for tech replacements, vacation, credit card annual fees. Then when I get side hustle income and bank bonuses I can divide it into those.

I can't even imagine those HCOL areas! I think it's pretty impressive that even with that high rent payment your monthly budget is $3500!

 

[SouthFayetteFan]

I'm paying down the CC debt as much as I can each month. I have not added to it. I'm transferring around to 0%/$0 fees while I work on it. I could PIF as I have the money in savings, but as a single mom, that is my safety net. So while it's 0% interest, I'll be hanging onto the cash flow (the ex lost his job this fall and while I'm pretty certain I'd be able to find something if I did, flying solo, I really need the safety net).
Selling the $300k house is NOT an option. 1- likely still upside down on it. It's one of the reasons I kept it in the divorce. We would have paid out $20-30k. We refied the year before the divorce and took out all equity. We paid down some debt and then put in a new furnace, floors, etc. 2- $300k is close to the cheapest house in our area. My Ex moved into a condo .5 mile away. His condo was $150k, but his monthly payment after assoc fees is only like $200 cheaper. Apartments are $2500+/mo. My mortgage is $1700. The house ain't going, LOL. Plus we are staying close to each other in order to make this divorce as easy as can be for the kiddos. They ride the same bus, same school, etc.
I have the shortest commute I've ever had. It's about 15 min drive.
I know the car payment is always the suggested thing to go when looking at budgets. But in the Metro Detroit area....car/lease payment is just part of life. The good news is I DO get a discount, LOL. The way I look at it, the payment offsets any costs I have with upkeep as I'm ALWAYS under warranty on the cars I drive. I just know that for example, tires on my Jeep would have been $1k. I pay $290/mo right now. For that I get piece of mind that I don't have to worry about unexpected costs. Yes, I know that those who drive used normally have some kinda savings for those expenses.
I've cut our cable cost and cell phones. I've dumped my gym membership and my lawn service. I use coupons when I can, cut back tremendously on eating out, etc. I need to price shop our insurance more seriously but when I did earlier this fall, I have a pretty decent rate. My BF jokes if I can get $1 for something, I'm listing it and selling it on FB or ebay. I need to get more serious about doing that and purging the house, but so far this fall I've made a couple hundred selling off my son's old hockey skates, my daughter's hunter boots, snowboard boots, snow pants, etc. I list any/all clothes I can on Poshmark or take to the local consignment. If there is a penny to be made off something, I try to get it. I then use that money to either buy the new item, or offset costs (like Christmas).

And for your last one.....BUT teaching SUCKS! LOL. Kidding/not kidding.

You definitely didn't have to respond to me, lol - totally wasn't criticizing you or your situation and didn't respect a thoughtful response! Of course a divorce (while not something I have ever experienced or understand) can throw a tremendous wrinkle into everything. I'm sure you are doing the best you can do and that's what matters! Don't let other's situations on a thread like this make you feel jealous or bad (and I know you said that tongue in cheek). What some of us FIRE folks do could be classified as a little crazy at times

 

[alryan]

I'm reading this and slightly jealous of y'all.

I became a single mom this year. In the divorce I kept the house, because truthfully I pay about the same on this mortgage as I would for a 2 bedroom apartment in our area. I got to take $9k in credit card debt as well (we split 50/50). It's kinda amazing, I've been flying solo on expenses since June. There used to be nearly an additional $100K in our budget...yet we lived paycheck to paycheck some months. And I was the one with the spending issue supposedly, LOL.

I'm a teacher with 20 lovely years in. I won't complain as I get paid kinda decent. I mean decent enough to keep floating the $300k house, the SUV, the travel sports, etc. But I am also not saving anything. All my "retirement" eggs are in the pension I have. I don't have any other retirement accounts. The kids have small 529's. I've ran the numbers, I'll have enough years/age to retire in 7 years....when my 13yo is in the midst of college and my 9yo is gearing up to enter as well. As much as I'd like to think he'll be getting a hockey scholarship, I'm sure we'll be paying. I think if I walk in 7 years and start to collect immediately I'm looking at $45k/yr.....which will likely be about 1/2 what I'm used to at the time. So it would be a HUGE adjustment. Of course there's always the option of getting some "fun" job to supplement expenses. I just wonder, knowing that I'm not able to really save right now (single income, and cutting costs where I can w/o punishing the kids, I'm not moving, I'm already in a super cheap SUV payment, etc), and I doubt save much in the future....is it even possible for me to figure out how to live on the $45k just as college expenses are coming up for both. If you know anything about teaching....well I'm shocked I made it 20 years, LOL....I teach HS!!!

Ideally once my son graduates I would be selling the house and downsizing. But I would likely stay in the area which is $$$, so not so sure on the cost savings there. I'd love to think I only have 7 years left in this nightmare, I mean chance to shape young people's lives.....(kidding most days I DO like it).

Divorce is an incredibly emotionally draining and stressful event, but don't let it be an excuse for you. Please take this in the kindest possible way, but trying to achieve financial independence isn't an accident and requires tough choices. It seems like you have already decided that it isn't possible for you to save. I'd encourage you to change that narrative. Go through all your expenses with a fine tooth comb, see what you can cut. I don't know what that is, but I know that it has to be something. Maybe it's only one travel sport per child, or none at all, or not staying in a hotel for those weekend tournament, cable, the latest cell phones, maybe you could downsize in your area. I don't know, but don't give up before you've even started. Everyone starts with their nest egg at zero and the only way out of it is to start saving.

ETA: Sorry, Just saw your other reply that you are doing a ton to try and cut back. Hang in there.

 

[Judique]

I'll play this one

• $ 4,638 - HOUSING (includes mortgage interest, property taxes & insurance)
• $ 1,889 - TRANSPORTATION (includes all public trans, gas, auto maint. costs offset by mileage reimbursements from work)
• $ 3,340 - UTILITIES (water, gas, electric)
• $ 2,242 - COMCAST CABLE/INTERNET
• $ 0 - TRAVEL (we took
  $12,048.78 in trips which were completely offset by CC points and loyalty programs)
• $ 12,599 - HEALTH & LIFE INS. (cost of employer health care and numerous life policies)
• $ 3,892 - GROCERIES ($324 per month for a family of 4)
• $ 2,151 - NECESSITIES (broad category of necessary expenses, clothes, toiletries, etc.)
• $ 721 - RESTAURANTS (proud to avg only $60 per month in this category)
• $ 11,610 - MISC DISCRETIONARY (everything that doesn't fit above and all discretionary - i.e. could be cut in a job loss situation
  
• $ 43,082 - SUBTOTAL ANNUAL EXPENSES

I know the Comcast sticks out as a major expense but we enjoy sports, we enjoy shows and the internet works well for me as I work at home 3-4 days a week.

In addition to the above items we also spend $15,580 on one major house item. We replaced a failing retaining wall. Since this should have a 25+ year life I wouldn't include it in our normal annual expenses. It does affect my savings rate for the year as I can't ignore the expense however.

Where do cell phones fit in?

I'm going to try to do more detailed record keeping this next year, as the money I spent is substantially higher than this. Your housing cost is very small. Maybe I should move to Pennsylvania!

But, even in my retired state, I'm still not spending all of my retirement income, for which I'm thankful. Even though my numbers looked good, I was slightly anxious about actually giving up my job. As it turns out, I'm still saving!

 

[SouthFayetteFan]

Where do cell phones fit in?

I'm going to try to do more detailed record keeping this next year, as the money I spent is substantially higher than this. Your housing cost is very small. Maybe I should move to Pennsylvania!

But, even in my retired state, I'm still not spending all of my retirement income, for which I'm thankful. Even though my numbers looked good, I was slightly anxious about actually giving up my job. As it turns out, I'm still saving!

Isn't there some sort of saying that sometimes "we have to acknowledge our privilege in this game"...so yeah I have some of that...

My wife and I tag on to a family plan that my dad has for him, mom and sister. He says that it costs him very little to add us and he does it essentially as a gift to us each month. Previously my phone became covered 100% by my old employer when I joined the Sr. Management team. So my wife was added to the family plan then so we could shut down our plan - we probably were going to pay our share of that and then he just told us not to since it was insignificant. Then when we sold that company, I was invited over to the family plan too as I lost my cell coverage about 6 months after the sale as severances and such started unwinding.

Another blessing we have is housing cost. We bought a fairly simple 3 bedroom ranch for $130k or so. It might be worth $150k today although I truly don't follow that stuff closely. There's a neighborhood behind our home that probably has homes for $400k and I'd guess their taxes are $10k or up. We decided when purchasing a house that we would not buy a starter home but rather a modest forever home. It's worked out for us so far

 

[Judique]

So this thread should be a bunch of friendly folks, but if you're looking for FIRE advice...there'd be a ton of tough love. This isn't directed at you so please don't take offense, but here's the FIRE advice you'd hear in your situation:

• Get rid of CC debt immediately, ALL discretionary spending is shut off completely until that's gone
• Sell the $300k house, downsize
• IF you have a long commute...Move somewhere closer to where you work to reduce commuting expense
• Sell the SUV to eliminate the payment and buy a less expensive car with all cash
• Find a way to cut expenses to actually save
• Don't quit your job in 7 years

You don't have to do any of these of course, lol. But this is what FIRE people would say if you wanted advice

I'd agree with most of that. But, I wouldn't sell the house. I'd suck it up and find someone to pay for a room. People pay $500-$900 a month around here just for a room. May not be the case in your area. In my case, I could rent a room with a bathroom that would cover my entire PITI mortgage payment. If daughter (ever) gets her own place I may do that just to have someone else in the house at night

The long commute: sometimes when you are closer to the job, your living expenses are higher. For instance @speedyfishy in Northern Va. Of course she would have to move far far away to get a lower costing place!

 

[Judique]

We decided when purchasing a house that we would not buy a starter home but rather a modest forever home. It's worked out for us so far

I didn't quote the cell phone plan part of the post but my son has a similar thing going with his sister. And I gave up Virgin and went with Comcast. This past month younger daughter and my plan cost was $12. Of course we paid full price for our Samsungs, but I got a Visa gift card for $250. I just keep waiting for Comcast to change things up.

I'm in a smaller 4 bedroom, 2 bath, and it is definitely my forever house. My costs are still higher than yours per year but its almost paid off. I looked at the numbers again yesterday after all the talk of making extra payments. It looks like a wash to me to keep doing it monthly, as monthly keeps cash in my accounts, versus in the home equity. I already have plenty of equity.

 

[tink1970]

Our prop taxes are about $2,800 of that number. Homeowners is about $600. The rest is ONLY mortgage interest. We also have about $6,000 in mortgage principal that I classify as savings (so if you wanted to include that it would be closer to $11k). However in 3 years or less we will eliminate the mortgage altogether meaning we can continue to live in our house for about $3,500 or less (I can't even begin to describe the peace of mind that gives me).

Oh my goodness! I guess in a trade off for our weather (which today at one point was 65 degrees!) we have the high rate of insurance (this year windstorm was $4200, flood+ overage $1000 and homeowners $4000) as well as property taxes (another $4100). On the bright side, we have no mortgage so guess you could call our monthly cost around $1115.

We decided when purchasing a house that we would not buy a starter home but rather a modest forever home. It's worked out for us so far

When we bought our current house I really really wanted to downsize but DH had his heart set on our current place. It's larger and requires more maintenance but to him it's worth it (and he's the FIRE-ish guy versus my burn through --quite a different kind of fire--philosophy). As we know, it takes all kinds and sometimes in a relationship you have to compromise. On the bright side, it's appreciated about $90k in the past two years so there's that.

@LilSweetPeaPhoto --a couple of thoughts:
1) divorce is hard and it stinks. It sounds fairly new so at this point I would focus (especially with ex-DH's being laid off) on the emergency fund and paying down your credit card bills. The first year (or two or so) is really hard. My DD still won't eat certain peanut butter brands because that was all I could afford after leaving her father. We had no furniture other than our beds and beanbag chairs (he father refused to pay child support). Time can be a great healer and now it seems like a bad dream so .

2) Thank you for teaching, it is often a thankless and under appreciated profession. If it weren't for a couple of supportive, understanding teachers, we would not be counting the days down until graduation (161).

 

[speedyfishy]

@speedyfishy That's actually a really good price on rent for your area since it includes gas, water, and parking.

That being said... I pay less than that in mortgage, PMI, insurance, and property taxes for a home on 17 acres less than two hours south of you... LOL.

It’s scary how high some rents are. Our apartment is definitely a luxury building with stainless steel applicances, package service, central AC, washer and dryer. My old apartment in NY didn’t even have a dishwasher lol. It’s a lot we are spending and I wish I could lower it but I don’t want to sacrifice too much. I’ve also gotten used to the trash valet service lol.

 

[GlamMistress]

I'll play this one

• $ 4,638 - HOUSING (includes mortgage interest, property taxes & insurance).

This made me roar with laughter and then green with envy. Your entire yearly spending = my yearly mortgage payments + extra principal! Congrats on the great housing deal!

 

[Judique]

It’s scary how high some rents are. Our apartment is definitely a luxury building with stainless steel applicances, package service, central AC, washer and dryer. My old apartment in NY didn’t even have a dishwasher lol. It’s a lot we are spending and I wish I could lower it but I don’t want to sacrifice too much. I’ve also gotten used to the trash valet service lol.

A good friend of my older daughter who now lives 'back home' here in our area with her husband and kids had an apartment near Times Square when she had an internship at CBS a few blocks away back about 15 plus years ago.

It was 2 rooms with kitchen facilities and a bath in between the bedroom and living room. No dishwasher or washer/dryer! She was 4th floor walkup and had a balcony about a foot wide. When you walked down the hall to the apartment you had to turn sideways to pass anyone walking towards you. It was soooo tiny! And the rent was close to 2K a month. But there was a bagel place on the corner and a Starbucks across the street.

Never the less, we enjoyed a weekend staying with her. But for future visits I did the Westin nearby.

 

[speedyfishy]

A good friend of my older daughter who now lives 'back home' here in our area with her husband and kids had an apartment near Times Square when she had an internship at CBS a few blocks away back about 15 plus years ago.

It was 2 rooms with kitchen facilities and a bath in between the bedroom and living room. No dishwasher or washer/dryer! She was 4th floor walkup and had a balcony about a foot wide. When you walked down the hall to the apartment you had to turn sideways to pass anyone walking towards you. It was soooo tiny! And the rent was close to 2K a month. But there was a bagel place on the corner and a Starbucks across the street.

Never the less, we enjoyed a weekend staying with her. But for future visits I did the Westin nearby.

Idk how I washed dishes every night. Lol the laundry isn’t that big of a deal if I love back to NY I’ll just pay for a wash dry and fold service. It’s cheaper than paying extra to have a washer and dryer in the apartment.

 

[amalone1013]

Lol the laundry isn’t that big of a deal if I love back to NY I’ll just pay for a wash dry and fold service. It’s cheaper than paying extra to have a washer and dryer in the apartment.

That's so crazy!

 

[afan]

Idk how I washed dishes every night. Lol the laundry isn’t that big of a deal if I love back to NY I’ll just pay for a wash dry and fold service. It’s cheaper than paying extra to have a washer and dryer in the apartment.

My mom has never had a dishwasher and while I miss having mine it's not a huge deal. But neither of us are use a ton of pots or pans to cook 1 meal with either so it's not bad. Also no room for one in the kitchen but I do worry about trying to sell the house without it someday.

 

[speedyfishy]

That's so crazy!

A washer/dryer in the apartment is a $500-1000 a month premium. They are so rare. My old building had it in the basement but I can’t do that anymore it took all day to do laundry

 

[Frwinkley]

Thoroughly enjoy this topic!

DH and myself, each 57 years old. Retirement is 5-6 years away. The only debt we have is a car payment; as much as I hate a payment, our loan is at 0%. We may pay it off sooner, just so we don't have a payment. We would have paid cash, had it not been for such a good financing offer. We own our home, so our housing expenses are related to property taxes, etc. I am a teacher (mid life career change), so will have about 1/2 my salary in my pension. We max out my DH's 401k, have some stocks, mutual funds with a brokerage firm. We have one child, a DD, 25 who is married and is about to finish dental school. Her undergraduate schooling was paid for by a combination of our own savings and a very smart grandmother. We are making interest payments on her dental school loans right now until she graduates (about $600 per month). Our goal was to make payments during the grace period before her loans capitalize. Since she is our only child, we'd rather help her out financially now when she needs it; after this, she and her engineer husband are on their own!

I do have a question: we have not yet opened any IRAs. We've funded retirement through 401ks and the mandatory pension contribution that I am required to make. Like must, I'd like to lower our tax liability as much as possible. If we open a traditional IRA and max it out, only about 1/2 of that has an impact on our taxes because of income limits. My thought is this: fund a traditional IRA with $3,000 (since that's about all that effects our tax burden) and use $4,000 to fund a Roth IRA.

Does that sound right?