No the Magic isn’t gone but it’s at 25%

[Smugpugmug]

Was that video produced by Poseidon Entertainment? Sounds like him. He does great stuff and is very interesting. I watched the two hours and was very impressed.

Oh this is Defunctland. He does mini documentaries about rides that no longer exist at theme parks, not just Disney. He's been expanding out to other topics thus the Fastpass video.

Agree about Poesidon. He's harsh at times but his videos are really interesting. I agree with him about why certain new ride additions feel underwhelming.

 

[bakenatj]

Oh this is Defunctland. He does mini documentaries about rides that no longer exist at theme parks, not just Disney. He's been expanding out to other topics thus the Fastpass video.

Agree about Poesidon. He's harsh at times but his videos are really interesting. I agree with him about why certain new ride additions feel underwhelming.

Thanks for sharing, I will check his stuff out.

 

[gharter]

I was able to do commando every-ride Magic Kingdom under the FP+ system without criss-crossing the park.

I agree, that was part of what made FP+ so good. I could get a FP, and MODIFY the ride or time as many times as I wanted. So you could make it so you criss-crossed the park many times or didn't. Genie + doesn't give you that flexibility.

 

[DCLMP]

I don’t disagree, I just think sometimes it comes off as whining, Disney has definitely made missteps I don’t think that is arguable, but I can’t wrap my mind around people demanding a change in their business model to ensure they individually benefit from it. it’s like I really want a Tesla, so I’ll demand they drop their price so that I can afford it.

The market will bear what the consumer is willing to pay for, and right now, they’re willing to pay for an awful lot

Next year the consumer won't be willing to pay it. I think people just need to wait for a little while. The deals will be back.

 

[pahoben]

So, my major question is:

If the magic is gone where did it go? Is someone holding it hostage? Did Bob Chapek eat it? Did Bluey take it with her to Australia? Did Mickey decide to hang up his ears? Was he replaced with an imposter.

This is a crime. We need to get the FBI involved.

Rumor is that Chapek and Captain James Hook did dine on it at Chapek's first strategy session after being named CEO. Chapek and Hook are apparently very close. Hook has been his mentor throughout his Disney career.

 

[Jrb1979]

I don’t disagree, I just think sometimes it comes off as whining, Disney has definitely made missteps I don’t think that is arguable, but I can’t wrap my mind around people demanding a change in their business model to ensure they individually benefit from it. it’s like I really want a Tesla, so I’ll demand they drop their price so that I can afford it.

The market will bear what the consumer is willing to pay for, and right now, they’re willing to pay for an awful lot

IMO it's not so much the cost of a Disney vacation that people are upset about. First I will say that I know staffing is a big problem and I'm sure most accept it.

Where people are upset is all the changes they have done and a lot not in a good way.

 

[mercuryvenus]

I think it’s easy to lose perspective. This is a theme park that we are all extremely lucky to be so familiar with that we can pick apart management’s decisions. For most people in this world, they will never go to a theme park, much less Disney World.

 

[Aluminum Falcon]

IMO it's not so much the cost of a Disney vacation that people are upset about. First I will say that I know staffing is a big problem and I'm sure most accept it.

Where people are upset is all the changes they have done and a lot not in a good way.

curious what changes, that don't ultimately lead back to in many people words on here "paying more, and getting less". If it all comes back to that, then we're really talking about money no matter how it's sugar coated imo

 

[Jrb1979]

curious what changes, that don't ultimately lead back to in many people words on here "paying more, and getting less". If it all comes back to that, then we're really talking about money no matter how it's sugar coated imo

For me it's not paying more for less. It's how more complex it is to visit now. From reservations to hoping the Genie+ works in my favor.

 

[mom2rtk]

I think it’s easy to lose perspective. This is a theme park that we are all extremely lucky to be so familiar with that we can pick apart management’s decisions. For most people in this world, they will never go to a theme park, much less Disney World.

No perspective required. It's OK to discuss and expect value for the cost of what one purchases. Even if it's a luxury item.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

For most people in this world, they will never go to a theme park, much less Disney World.

You're on the Theme Parks and Attractions part of this Board, I'm pretty sure everyone already knows this. At this point I'm unsure what you're representing here.

First you got in one everyone who wasn't posting amazing things about the parks, you enjoyed them loved them and can't wait to get back and you didn't understand why others were posting about how they didn't love it/enjoy it as much as you, then you've moved onto mocking in a sarcastic way to posters and now you're about the "just be fortunate there's a bunch of starving kids out there" kind of spiel.

What do you want out of this thread?

 

[mercuryvenus]

You're on the Theme Parks and Attractions part of this Board, I'm pretty sure everyone already knows this. At this point I'm unsure what you're representing here.

First you got in one everyone who wasn't posting amazing things about the parks, you enjoyed them loved them and can't wait to get back and you didn't understand why others were posting about how they didn't love it/enjoy it as much as you, then you've moved onto mocking in a sarcastic way to posters and now you're about the "just be fortunate there's a bunch of starving kids out there" kind of spiel.

What do you want out of this thread?

Just trying to point out some perspective. That’s all.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Just trying to point out some perspective. That’s all.

Well it isn't coming across to me like that's what you're doing that's for sure.

 

[Jrb1979]

Just trying to point out some perspective. That’s all.

I do understand your side of it. I've never been in the camp of "I'm just happy to be here" and to make the best of it when you go. My issue has never been the crowds, price or the parks themselves. It's how complex and the amount of planning required to have that magic.

 

[MomOTwins]

curious what changes, that don't ultimately lead back to in many people words on here "paying more, and getting less". If it all comes back to that, then we're really talking about money no matter how it's sugar coated imo

I don't think that is the whole story. For me, what I've most often lamented about in the past couple years is the slow removal of the little conveniences that made Disney so much less stressful than it is today.

• Used to be your luggage was tagged before you traveled and delivered to your hotel room. No waiting around at baggage claim with squirmy kids, and then hauling luggage while pushing a stroller, just beeline from the airplane to DME and you were on vaycay. I would pay to get this service back, but it's just gone.
• No dining plan--yes this was partly way to save money, but for me, also just a real de-stresser on vacay. My kids want some more dole whips or a ridiculously large lollipop? DH or I want to sample some tiny but overpriced tidbit at the Epcot festival booths? Another character meal, why not? Don't have to think about the cost and start to feel stressed, it's all included in the budget. It's part of what I like about cruising--even if the cost of food is baked into the vacation price, it's nice to have the trip all budgeted and paid for ahead of time so you don't need to do mental math on the fly every meal and snack of the trip.
• ADRs at 180 days were a snap--the majority of people don't book vacations that far out, so I often was able to get everything I wanted even if I waited weeks or months after ADRs opened. Now I have to be awake at 4:45am my time at the 60 day mark just to have a chance at a few ADRs toward the end of my trip. And have to do that twice, with even more limited selection, if we have a split stay (which we often do). Just such an unpleasant way to plan for a trip.
• Reduced housekeeping at resorts (and for DVC, removal of the option to pay extra for daily housekeeping) = more work for me tidying up after my kids on vacation, sweeping up their crumbs from their breakfast/snacks in the room, having to chase down clean towels etc.
• And now for G+ specifically:
  • Some days I like to sleep in after walking 20 miles the day prior (shocking, I know). Say goodbye to that with 7am G+ wakeup calls every day.
  • In the old FP days, you could choose your return times, so it was great--book three in the morning, plan on a midday resort break, and have an evening FP waiting for you that doesn't conflict with dinner times. Now you're at the mercy of the system--that 9am time you thought you could book turns to 2pm, when you planned to be at the resort, or during a meal time, or late at night after the kids' bedtime. You are at the mercy of the schedule Genie+ chooses for you
  • Inability to plan 60 days ahead means going into the vacation with a lot of uncertainty and no way to manage kids expectations. We used to look together as a family at the 60 day mark and each kid would pick a ride they wanted. Maybe it wasn't their first choice because their first choice was taken, but it was an even playing field and they all had the same opportunity to choose something. Now I have to pit them against each other and against me. DS6 loves SDD but my DS10s think it is a kiddie ride, one wants TOT, and the other wants RORC. In the old days, if their favorites weren't available at 60 days, that wasn't my fault, that's just what there was to choose from. Now it's all on me to shoulder the blame if I choose to go for SDD first, get a late return time, and by the time 120 minutes rolls around the rides someone else wanted is gone.

Bottom line, if they had just given me the old system and charged me more for it, it'd be so much better than this new more stressful version they've created.

 

[Skicks35]

People will gladly pay more for convenience and certainty. The problem is Disney is now charging more for an inferior product (even without mentioning that the new system is replacing a free system).

I see that DLP is now offering a €90/day add on that seems to be similar to Max Pass, but even without the hour timeslots. You pay in advance for the opportunity to have LL at all or most rides whenever you want; just show up and scan in. I realize it's basically the cost of a 2nd ticket, but I would think a lot of people would be more willing to pay $100 for this as it offers a lot more convenience (no zig zagging; conflicting with ADRs) and certainty (knowing you have LL access without playing the availability game at 7am and throughout the day) compared to the current offering for Genie+ at $15.. Honestly hope it makes its way to WDW eventually.

I was there a couple different times in May (DVC GotG preview and DHS Moonlight Magic) and Genie+ was fine. It didn't make or break my trips. In my opinion, the real issue now is attraction downtime. I understand rides break down, but to have rides break down for extended periods of time everyday becomes incredibly exhausting. There was a time when Pirates, Splash, HM were all down at once and Space Mtn was only operating one side, which obviously throws every other attraction's wait time out of whack.

Disney's #1 priority now should be better ride maintenance (which obviously could be impacted by staffing shortages). You get your rides operating at a more consistent level, your average wait times go down and you average guest experience would go up.

 

[DCLMP]

Just trying to point out some perspective. That’s all.

I don’t really get what pp got so worked up you comment. Inflation being what it is I feel fortunate I can even still afford a vacation.

 

[Smugpugmug]

I see that DLP is now offering a €90/day add on that seems to be similar to Max Pass, but even without the hour timeslots. You pay in advance for the opportunity to have LL at all or most rides whenever you want; just show up and scan in. I realize it's basically the cost of a 2nd ticket, but I would think a lot of people would be more willing to pay $100 for this as it offers a lot more convenience (no zig zagging; conflicting with ADRs) and certainty (knowing you have LL access without playing the availability game at 7am and throughout the day) compared to the current offering for Genie+ at $15.. Honestly hope it makes its way to WDW eventually.

I'm going to be completely honest when I say that I would be willing to pay for that Premier Pass Disneyland Paris has if it came to WDW, however it's easy for me to say that when I am a single person with no children. Larger groups and/or people with multiple kids would be reluctant to spend that kind of money on top of park tickets, flights and hotels. Just the thought of not having to deal with competing with other guests in booking rides at 7 am would be what makes me buy it.

 

[toontoy]

I don't think that is the whole story. For me, what I've most often lamented about in the past couple years is the slow removal of the little conveniences that made Disney so much less stressful than it is today.

• Used to be your luggage was tagged before you traveled and delivered to your hotel room. No waiting around at baggage claim with squirmy kids, and then hauling luggage while pushing a stroller, just beeline from the airplane to DME and you were on vaycay. I would pay to get this service back, but it's just gone.
• No dining plan--yes this was partly way to save money, but for me, also just a real de-stresser on vacay. My kids want some more dole whips or a ridiculously large lollipop? DH or I want to sample some tiny but overpriced tidbit at the Epcot festival booths? Another character meal, why not? Don't have to think about the cost and start to feel stressed, it's all included in the budget. It's part of what I like about cruising--even if the cost of food is baked into the vacation price, it's nice to have the trip all budgeted and paid for ahead of time so you don't need to do mental math on the fly every meal and snack of the trip.
• ADRs at 180 days were a snap--the majority of people don't book vacations that far out, so I often was able to get everything I wanted even if I waited weeks or months after ADRs opened. Now I have to be awake at 4:45am my time at the 60 day mark just to have a chance at a few ADRs toward the end of my trip. And have to do that twice, with even more limited selection, if we have a split stay (which we often do). Just such an unpleasant way to plan for a trip.
• Reduced housekeeping at resorts (and for DVC, removal of the option to pay extra for daily housekeeping) = more work for me tidying up after my kids on vacation, sweeping up their crumbs from their breakfast/snacks in the room, having to chase down clean towels etc.
• And now for G+ specifically:
  • Some days I like to sleep in after walking 20 miles the day prior (shocking, I know). Say goodbye to that with 7am G+ wakeup calls every day.
  • In the old FP days, you could choose your return times, so it was great--book three in the morning, plan on a midday resort break, and have an evening FP waiting for you that doesn't conflict with dinner times. Now you're at the mercy of the system--that 9am time you thought you could book turns to 2pm, when you planned to be at the resort, or during a meal time, or late at night after the kids' bedtime. You are at the mercy of the schedule Genie+ chooses for you
  • Inability to plan 60 days ahead means going into the vacation with a lot of uncertainty and no way to manage kids expectations. We used to look together as a family at the 60 day mark and each kid would pick a ride they wanted. Maybe it wasn't their first choice because their first choice was taken, but it was an even playing field and they all had the same opportunity to choose something. Now I have to pit them against each other and against me. DS6 loves SDD but my DS10s think it is a kiddie ride, one wants TOT, and the other wants RORC. In the old days, if their favorites weren't available at 60 days, that wasn't my fault, that's just what there was to choose from. Now it's all on me to shoulder the blame if I choose to go for SDD first, get a late return time, and by the time 120 minutes rolls around the rides someone else wanted is gone.

Bottom line, if they had just given me the old system and charged me more for it, it'd be so much better than this new more stressful version they've created.

I agree with you, the Luggage delivery and dining plan are sorely missed for our family. With 2 kids, we often did character buffets and they love the mickey bars. It did save us some money, but the main thing was not thinking about paying over 6 bucks for a mickey bar. Our last trip in April I couldn't even find an ADR for a character meal at 60 days.

I agree with your points to Genie+. 7am doesn't sound terrible until I thought about it being 5am at home. With little kids we often skipped rope drop and went to the parks at 11am (not ideal I know) but then we stayed and closed down the parks even the 1am deluxe times at the MK. This program didnt work for us and we couldnt really see the value in it.

Sadly with a 2yr old and 6 yr old we are skipping our next few trips and going back to the beach. We may return if they fix all the issues but I have to say our trip was one of the most expensive experiments I have ever participated in. Usually when a company tests a product they give you something for the inconveniences.

I do have to say that the resort is now for teens and adults and not really a family park at all.

 

[Skicks35]

I'm going to be completely honest when I say that I would be willing to pay for that Premier Pass Disneyland Paris has if it came to WDW, however it's easy for me to say that when I am a single person with no children. Larger groups and/or people with multiple kids would be reluctant to spend that kind of money on top of park tickets, flights and hotels. Just the thought of not having to deal with competing with other guests in booking rides at 7 am would be what makes me buy it.

Oh absolutely. Everyone is obviously in a different situation, but I think if it was offered in addition to Genie+, then people would at least have have options.

If this Premier Pass was an option, I bet people would happily save up for it as well, knowing full well that it's a superior product.