Marathon Weekend 2023

[camaker]

SAFD: Aside from my constant GI issues on long runs, training is freaking awesome. I used Hanson’s beginner marathon plan for Chicago and will recycle it for Dopey. I still have to write up my Chicago race report, but even though things didn’t end the way I wanted I FEEL FANTASTIC!!! I do not feel like I ran a marathon at all. I am not sore and don’t have one ache or pain. I am taking this week off from running. I will still be doing strength training in the form of hurricane and flood clean up though. I am going to give Tailwind another try. I don‘t really enjoy carrying a lot of liquids with me, but I’m at the end of my rope. I bought the Ultraspire hydration belt that @camaker posted about and I really like it. It is super lightweight, doesn’t bounce, no riding up, no falling down, no clips digging into my body and doesn’t end up a soggy gross mess. My belt only has one bottle, but may invest in the two bottle belt if Tailwind works out.

I am not a believer of having to run multiple 20+ miles during training if you don’t have to. Having @DopeyBadger create some plans for me was a game changer. His plans had me maxing out at 14 miles for Dopey and Goofy. My current Hanson’s plan has me maxing out at 16 miles at long run pace. That is about 2.5 hours for me which is perfect considering I usually have two other big mileage runs during the week. I am sure some people would look at my plan and think I am crazy, but I really enjoy running (most of the time!).

I kinda feel horrible for typing this out, but the marathon/goofy/dopey Galloway plans from the RunDisney website make me cringe. The hours and hours dedicated to a single run I see posted on social media is sometimes awful to read and at times heartbreaking because people can’t make that distance and end up feeling discouraged about the actual race. I have used them myself as a beginner for my first 10K and my first Half. Yeah, they got me over the finish line, but I felt like crap after every long run and after the races. I just scratch my head at the idea of running 26 during training and not giving the body time to heal. I always take time off after a marathon to give my body a much needed break. I think the run/walk method is a GREAT tool, but that method can be incorporated in better written plans. I have read that custom plans from Galloway are totally different than what is put out there for Disney, but I’ve never seen one myself.

Glad the hydration belt is working for you! I have both the single and double bottle versions so I can use whichever is appropriate for the distance. I will say that I much prefer the double bottle belt, as I find it more balanced and comfortable as well as easier to get the bottles into and out of. The light system you can swap into the front panel has been fantastic, as well.

On the nutrition front, have you tried Huma gels? Lack of stomach upset is one of their big advertising points. I went through a period where just about anything, solid, gel or gummy, was upsetting my stomach during marathon distances. Huma gels were magic. No more GI discomfort. Regardless, good luck with it. There's not much worse than stomach issues during a race!

 

[Bree]

Glad the hydration belt is working for you! I have both the single and double bottle versions so I can use whichever is appropriate for the distance. I will say that I much prefer the double bottle belt, as I find it more balanced and comfortable as well as easier to get the bottles into and out of. The light system you can swap into the front panel has been fantastic, as well.

On the nutrition front, have you tried Huma gels? Lack of stomach upset is one of their big advertising points. I went through a period where just about anything, solid, gel or gummy, was upsetting my stomach during marathon distances. Huma gels were magic. No more GI discomfort. Regardless, good luck with it. There's not much worse than stomach issues during a race!

I have been using Huma for a couple years I tried switching to just Endurance Tap since it was pure maple syrup, salt and ginger. Same results. Tried a combo of the two. Same results. I am wondering if my thyroid is acting up again. I take medication, but it’s so hard to keep regulated. I have a visit with my specialist soon so I’ll bring the question up with her.

 

[bryana]

SAFD: Training is going so well. I'm about half way through peak month for the Philly Marathon next month and I really don't know if I've ever felt this good through a training cycle. Going to add one more DopeyBadger shout out to the (well deserved) lovefest that's been happening for him in the last few pages.


I'm also glad to know that I'm not alone in the way I've been feeling about the Galloway plan lately as I see more and more insta-friends posting their training journeys lately as we get closer to race day. There are so many factors in play on any given day that can influence a good or bad running day and I hate to see people have a terrible training run and then spend 2 weeks stressed out until their next big training run.

His plan is what got me through MW 2018 (although I capped my long run at 18 or 20) so I have experience with them and I know that it works but I guess it just wasn't really "for me" or at least it isn't for me in the place in life I am 5 years later. I feel way better physically and mentally now doing the 5 day a week plan with way higher mileage than I did back then. Is it more of a time commitment during the week? Sure. However, it's a lot more manageable to spend 5 or 6 hours running spread over two days of the weekend than being out there for 6 hours one day. I also think that a huge part of it is as others have said in this thread, people like the idea of doing the distance in training to know that they can. I totally understand that, and can see why people want to do it. As someone who has done 3 marathons (albeit one was done very poorly and the other 2 are Disney so they're "different"), I know I can do the distance so that takes that mental part of the training plan out of the picture for me.

 

[sandam1]

I have read that custom plans from Galloway are totally different than what is put out there for Disney, but I’ve never seen one myself.

I am currently doing a CTP and it really isn't that different. The fundamental concepts (2 short runs, 1 long run per week, capping out at 26 miles) are pretty much the same. The thing that CTP does - and that I think the runDisney plans don't - is convey the nuances. Things like how to bridge the jumps in mileage (particularly if you miss a long run), what you should be doing on the short runs, and how the whole works together. I've done the runDisney plan for my first half marathon and my first 10K/half challenge and it's adequate if everything is going fine, but CTP shines when things start getting complicated.

Yeah, they got me over the finish line, but I felt like crap after every long run and after the races. I just scratch my head at the idea of running 26 during training and not giving the body time to heal. I always take time off after a marathon to give my body a much needed break.

The two things - that are fundamentally related - that I see people mess up with Galloway is that they:

1. Place emphasis on interval ratios versus pace. I know that I did this and I see people do it all of the time. I thought that I needed to run more to get faster when, in fact, for me, my overall pace is faster when my run interval is shorter. All running longer does is tire me out faster.

2. Go waaaaay too fast on their long runs. This seems to come from either aren't using the Magic Mile calculator or not implementing the paces properly (see point #1). The long runs are about time on feet. The program is designed so that you are going slow enough that you don't have to take time off to recover. The only time you are supposed to go fast in a long run is on race day.

Combine these two mistakes and yeah, you've got the recipe for a big problem. Could the runDisney plan be clearer? Definitely. But Jeff has a ton of books that people can also reference and it's probably pretty hard to summarize entire books into 1-2 pages. It doesn't mean that the method doesn't work, it just means that the summary that people are using isn't adequate.

I know a few fundamental things about my Galloway/CTP experience:

- I would not be a runner without Jeff Galloway and run/walk/run. I tried constant running before and HATED it, but when I first heard about r/w/r, I was like "I could do that."
- I've been working with CTP since the end of May, have worked up from 2 to 17 miles, and have stayed fundamentally healthy. This isn't all a by-product of the training plan - my physical therapist's strength program needs to get a reasonable amount of credit as well - but obviously CTP is working for me.
- My body loves running 3 days a week and the balance of rest and cross-training that I'm getting in between. My feet feel better and better as time goes by - even as I continue to increase mileage, which makes a very happy runner.

I struggled - a lot - with making a decision on training plans and the long runs were a huge stumbling block for me. However, today, I'm glad that I took the leap of faith. I hope that on race day, everyone has that same feeling. No regrets!

 

[lookingforsunshine]

The program is designed so that you are going slow enough that you don't have to take time off to recover. The only time you are supposed to go fast in a long run is on race day.

Yes— I think this gets missed a lot. I just watched a video where a prominent “runDisfluencer” said for this upcoming week, the program says to walk 7 on Saturday and run/walk 17 on Sunday. She scoffed at the idea of walking 7, saying she wouldn’t do that but she will run it. This was also said right around her reflecting that she did Galloway for Goofy too before and didn’t follow the program completely (getting to 20 miles tops) and thus struggled in the marathon (I do think that was also the really hot year though). I’m curious what the CTP looks like for simulation weekends, and if it also emphasizes walking Saturday. I do know from listening to Rise and Run, where a lot of them use CTP, that Galloway also suggests walking the half marathon for Dopey weekend. It seems like a lot of people following the plan don’t want to do that, though. And it’s hard to understand if the program is truly working for them because, at least for the “influencers,” I think they’re trying to make themselves like… leaders or examples for people to look up to? I don’t know.

I would not be a runner without Jeff Galloway and run/walk/run.

Me either!!! I love intervals so much, and I love not being made to feel bad about them lol. I met him at MW 2015, and he was a nice dude. I got to thank him for teaching me about intervals. My plan isn’t designed by Galloway but still uses intervals. Love that for me I think Ariel would also say intervals are awesome— she even inspired my training journal title! Haha.

 

[jpeterson]

I’m curious what the CTP looks like for simulation weekends, and if it also emphasizes walking Saturday

Yes CTP suggests walking. In fact the exact verbiage for the "challenge walks" is: "As you increase the distance of a long walk on one day, followed by a long run the next day, the body prepares to “go the distance” in multiple events on race weekend. You can’t go too slowly during either the walk or the run: your goal is simply to finish each one with strength."

 

[BigEeyore]

SAFD: Just ran Chicago this past weekend, unlike @Bree I'm SORE! Doing recovery stuff this week - easy swimming/cycling to work out the lactic acid, followed by focused stretching/rolling. Not sure if I will jump back into long runs in two weeks or three - I really want to give my body the time it needs to recover.
I have always used Hal Higdon's plans, and they work well for me. I came to distance running through triathlon though, so substituting at least one run a week for a cycling session or swim is what works best for me mentally and physically. I usually top out at 20 miles, and try to get in two 20 milers in a marathon training cycle (only got one in for Chicago though and I was fine).
I have massive respect for Jeff Galloway - I have ridden the bus with him post-race, and he is such a wonderful person. The fact that his plans have allowed thousands of people, who were too intimidated to get into distance running before, to accomplish amazing things is incredible. BUT his plans are just not for me, and that's OK!
@Bree I used to have GI issues with running long distances - I carry Tailwind with me now (refilling the bottle on course is a pain but I am happy to lose a minute or so to stick with what works!), and I take a shot block every few miles after the first 10-12 (I can't stomach gels). I will also say that ever since I gave up eating animal products 4 years ago, my GI issues pretty much went away. I know that's not for everyone, but it's what worked for me!

 

[HangWithMerida]

I have been using Huma for a couple years I tried switching to just Endurance Tap since it was pure maple syrup, salt and ginger. Same results. Tried a combo of the two. Same results. I am wondering if my thyroid is acting up again. I take medication, but it’s so hard to keep regulated. I have a visit with my specialist soon so I’ll bring the question up with her.

GI issues are the worst. I have a friend who is dealing with this as well. She ultimately broke down and went to see a GI dr and got a nutritionist. They have been working her through a huge elimination diet and slowly replacing things for several months. She is feeling better and is now also building mileage after an injury. I know she’s nervous about getting back up to truly long distance as that was what sparked the worst of her GI problems but she is doing shorter distances now without issues and that wasn’t always the case. I hope you figure out what is causing yours.

 

[DisneyParrothead]

Yes— I think this gets missed a lot. I just watched a video where a prominent “runDisfluencer” said for this upcoming week, the program says to walk 7 on Saturday and run/walk 17 on Sunday. She scoffed at the idea of walking 7, saying she wouldn’t do that but she will run it. This was also said right around her reflecting that she did Galloway for Goofy too before and didn’t follow the program completely (getting to 20 miles tops) and thus struggled in the marathon (I do think that was also the really hot year though). I’m curious what the CTP looks like for simulation weekends, and if it also emphasizes walking Saturday. I do know from listening to Rise and Run, where a lot of them use CTP, that Galloway also suggests walking the half marathon for Dopey weekend. It seems like a lot of people following the plan don’t want to do that, though. And it’s hard to understand if the program is truly working for them because, at least for the “influencers,” I think they’re trying to make themselves like… leaders or examples for people to look up to? I don’t know.

Me either!!! I love intervals so much, and I love not being made to feel bad about them lol. I met him at MW 2015, and he was a nice dude. I got to thank him for teaching me about intervals. My plan isn’t designed by Galloway but still uses intervals. Love that for me I think Ariel would also say intervals are awesome— she even inspired my training journal title! Haha.

Walking certainly isn’t sexy if you want to be an influencer, but it’s still a good workout. Walking at speed isn’t easy. Just watch the race walkers. Of course, their speed walking times are still much faster than my run times

 

[Herding_Cats]

I thought that I needed to run more to get faster when, in fact, for me, my overall pace is faster when my run interval is shorter. All running longer does is tire me out faster.


- I would not be a runner without Jeff Galloway and run/walk/run. I tried constant running before and HATED it, but when I first heard about r/w/r, I was like "I could do that."

Same, and same. I know that a lot of runners in here use intervals for their training plans with and without following an actual JG plan. And it's made marathoning so accessible to me.

I do know from listening to Rise and Run, where a lot of them use CTP, that Galloway also suggests walking the half marathon for Dopey weekend.

I heard them talking about that when I was listening during one of my runs last week and am intrigued!


For the experienced Dopey'ers: how do you approach the challenge during race weekend? Do you walk/go extra slow during certain races? Go "normal" and survive the marathon? I like to pre-plan things so I can get comfortable with an idea and make all of my contingency plans.

I have massive respect for Jeff Galloway - I have ridden the bus with him post-race, and he is such a wonderful person. The fact that his plans have allowed thousands of people, who were too intimidated to get into distance running before, to accomplish amazing things is incredible. BUT his plans are just not for me, and that's OK!

YES! So many ways for all of us to be successful.

 

[camaker]

For the experienced Dopey'ers: how do you approach the challenge during race weekend? Do you walk/go extra slow during certain races? Go "normal" and survive the marathon? I like to pre-plan things so I can get comfortable with an idea and make all of my contingency plans.

I don't go into Dopey intending to set any PRs, just to enjoy the experience of four consecutive 2am wake up calls followed by interminable waiting and then running through the most magical place on earth (and its connecting roads). With that in mind, my general approach is to run the first three races in my @DopeyBadger easy pace range, then go out at my long run pace for the marathon. Depending on how I'm feeling during the marathon I'll adjust the pace up or down a bit.

 

[DopeyBadger]

For the experienced Dopey'ers: how do you approach the challenge during race weekend? Do you walk/go extra slow during certain races? Go "normal" and survive the marathon? I like to pre-plan things so I can get comfortable with an idea and make all of my contingency plans.

I think it depends on what experience you're looking for out of the race weekend. The harder you take the races relatively speaking, the harder the race weekend will be. So if you take the early races easier, then the longer races will be "easier". Read - they won't be easy, but they will be "easier" than they could be. So it comes down to your goals. Is your goal to finish the Dopey Challenge and then to be able to do the rest of the Disney vacation stuff? Then take your time on the shorter races, take pics, goof off, etc. The slower you go relatively speaking, the less challenging it will be physically. Now the slower you go relatively speaking means different things for different people. A 3 hr marathon fitness level person has a lot more wiggle room in terms of going slow and finishing the Dopey Challenge, then does a 6.25 hr marathon fitness level person. For some, there is no other choice than to go really hard in order to be able to finish.

For me, I try and PR all four races consecutively. I'm there to challenge myself physically. Disney itself is a side-note to me. I'm at Disney because it offers a place where my wife and daughter like to vacation while I like to run. So I run. The Dopey Challenge was always fun to me because it felt like an "olympic" challenge to me. A multi-day race approach where you've got extra strategy to keep in mind as you go along. But while I try and PR all four races, I won't hit "ideal" times on all four races. Through my five attempts, I've found that my 5k/10k times are about 100% ideal, the HM is about 4% slower than ideal, and the M is about 6-10% slower than ideal. Meaning if I didn't have the three prior races before the M, then in theory I could have run about 6-10% faster.

 

[Baloo in MI]

I use intervals and swear by them now. But I do not follow a JG or runDisney plan. Fair to say that my plan is influenced by JG’s plans though. My PT is a firm believer in run/walk/run and converted me. I have found I stay stronger so much longer in a run, hold my form better during the run and recover much faster. As an example, Saturday I ran 35.5 miles as part of an event I was doing. Sunday I took my dog on a looong walk, no soreness at all. Felt strong and ready to go. I had 4 miles planned on Tuesday and I felt completely normal, had a good run! Except I was pacing too fast for my plan and had to keep backing off.

@Herding_Cats
As for Dopey or Goofy and being an interval runner. I race all four races. But the key for me is that I am training for that and will have several weeks of simulation weekends with four straight run days with increasing distances. I do not go out to 26 miles, but I will go to 20 at the far end of my plan. Given that MW has folks who run hard throughout and others who just want to finish and maximize the fun and everything in between. There is plenty of room to pursue the weekend for the experience you want. So if walking one of the races best supports your plan then do it. RunDisney events are certainly the best environment for doing your own thing.

 

[MissLiss279]

For the experienced Dopey'ers: how do you approach the challenge during race weekend? Do you walk/go extra slow during certain races? Go "normal" and survive the marathon? I like to pre-plan things so I can get comfortable with an idea and make all of my contingency plans.

I have sometimes tried to PR or just run hard the 5k (maybe a time or two the 10k), and then take all the other races at easy/long run paces. I did PR all 4 races in 2018, but I had so much potential that I was just then ‘realizing’ that it wasn’t extremely hard to PR any of the races. Now, it would be extremely difficult to do because I’m at the point where I might be able to take a few seconds off a time, but not 10s of minutes.

ETA: I should probably say that it was plans from @DopeyBadger that helped me get to those PRs!

 

[GreatLakes]

I don't agree with the Galloway plans. I have no doubt they are well researched and there is data backing them up but I don't see a need to go 26.2 miles in marathon training. On top of distance there should be time caps on any long run calculated as a percentage of weekly time. I looked back through all of my marathon training and the longest run I have ever done was 20 and I've never spend 3 hours or more on any single run. For my marathon PR I never did over 18 or over 2:20 and I don't intend to do another long run past 18 for my Boston training.

 

[garneska]

@Baloo in MI what are your interval lengths? I have started doing intervals this year because of injury. My current training I do 3 runs continuous running (my easy days) then my 2 hard days (speed and long) I do intervals. My hope is, like you, I will find that i can hold onto my running form and pace longer into the marathon. I am currently doing 10 min run, then i walk 2 min (though i usually start my jog at 1:30 and then pick it back up to run at 2 min). Seems to be working for me but wondering what others are doing.

 

[FFigawi]

For the experienced Dopey'ers: how do you approach the challenge during race weekend? Do you walk/go extra slow during certain races? Go "normal" and survive the marathon? I like to pre-plan things so I can get comfortable with an idea and make all of my contingency plans.

Like most things in running, this really comes down to each individual. For me, I usually take it easy during the 5k and 10k - or run over to DHS in the middle of the race to get a Rise time as the case may have been one year . For the half, I mostly take it easy as well, but since it's my least favorite of the four courses during marathon weekend, I sometimes will run it fast enough to use for a future proof of time. Only once have I ever raced the marathon, and that's only because it was my last shot at getting a qualifying proof of time to run Comrades a few months later. Normally, the marathon is ~6 hours of fun with the Goof Troop Roving Road Party (TM).

 

[sandam1]

I just watched a video where a prominent “runDisfluencer” said for this upcoming week, the program says to walk 7 on Saturday and run/walk 17 on Sunday. She scoffed at the idea of walking 7, saying she wouldn’t do that but she will run it. This was also said right around her reflecting that she did Galloway for Goofy too before and didn’t follow the program completely (getting to 20 miles tops) and thus struggled in the marathon (I do think that was also the really hot year though).

Walking certainly isn’t sexy if you want to be an influencer, but it’s still a good workout.

YES! I suspect that there is some disdain and/or ego in the play here. I guess I don't follow enough influencers to have seen this.

My thought on following a plan is that someone way smarter and with way more experience in running has crafted this plan - and in the case of CTP, I'm paying for the benefit of their experience. Who am I to randomly make changes to it? If my coach tells me to do something, I might want to understand why, but I'm probably going to do it.

I’m curious what the CTP looks like for simulation weekends, and if it also emphasizes walking Saturday.

As @jpeterson mentioned, my CTP also has walk 3 and walk 7 for this weekend (and run/walk 20).

I have an insane work event this weekend in addition to the back to back to back runs. Unfortunately, there was no other weekend to move the runs to as I have a local 10K next weekend and then Wine & Dine so I'm going to make it work. However, I might see if I can do some running during the 7 miler (I'm thinking walk 2 or 3, run 2 or 3, walk 2), just to save time on my feet and to get it done a little quicker. But normally, I would do the walking per the plan.

I met him at MW 2015, and he was a nice dude.

I actually saw Jeff during one of last year's races and I felt too shy to stop and talk to him. Afterwards, I heard everyone say how welcoming he is and I was kicking myself for turning down the opportunity. I promised to allow myself to go fan-girl (low key, but still) at this year's race.

 

[Baloo in MI]

@Baloo in MI what are your interval lengths? I have started doing intervals this year because of injury. My current training I do 3 runs continuous running (my easy days) then my 2 hard days (speed and long) I do intervals. My hope is, like you, I will find that i can hold onto my running form and pace longer into the marathon. I am currently doing 10 min run, then i walk 2 min (though i usually start my jog at 1:30 and then pick it back up to run at 2 min). Seems to be working for me but wondering what others are doing.

I run a 4:00/:30 split. I have found running any less feels too soon to start the walk interval. My PT swears to the belief that anything over a 30 second walk is wasted time in terms of diminished recovery benefits. Also I keep a high cadence when walking and ghat really helps my transitions.

 

[kps7795]

Yes— I think this gets missed a lot. I just watched a video where a prominent “runDisfluencer” said for this upcoming week, the program says to walk 7 on Saturday and run/walk 17 on Sunday. She scoffed at the idea of walking 7, saying she wouldn’t do that but she will run it. This was also said right around her reflecting that she did Galloway for Goofy too before and didn’t follow the program completely (getting to 20 miles tops) and thus struggled in the marathon (I do think that was also the really hot year though). I’m curious what the CTP looks like for simulation weekends, and if it also emphasizes walking Saturday. I do know from listening to Rise and Run, where a lot of them use CTP, that Galloway also suggests walking the half marathon for Dopey weekend. It seems like a lot of people following the plan don’t want to do that, though. And it’s hard to understand if the program is truly working for them because, at least for the “influencers,” I think they’re trying to make themselves like… leaders or examples for people to look up to? I don’t know.

Me either!!! I love intervals so much, and I love not being made to feel bad about them lol. I met him at MW 2015, and he was a nice dude. I got to thank him for teaching me about intervals. My plan isn’t designed by Galloway but still uses intervals. Love that for me I think Ariel would also say intervals are awesome— she even inspired my training journal title! Haha.

Whose YouTube video were you watching? I’m curious and would like to see it.