Anyone else struggling with the climate of evasiveness?

[WDWFERN]

Ok, I will admit I am probably overly optimistic boarding on naive, don’t readily embrace change, and realize that at the end of the day DVC is a time share sales, but all that aside I am struggling with the recent evasiveness from DVD.

Our family loves vacationing at Disney and have shared some wonderful times together there. Sure, some trips have been more magical than others, but that is to be expected. And I fully understand Disney has needed to make changes along the way over the last few years and that the perks and benefits could come and go. But at the end of the day, we trusted that the questions we had about DVC were explained with a reasonable degree of transparency so we subsequently understood the product we had decided to allocate much of our disposable income to.

But now, I find myself bothered by the lack of communication from DVD when asked specific questions about what was mentioned at the annual meeting regarding the new Poly tower. Add to that somewhat mixed messaging about restrictions, all of the workings over the last few months to set up the trust for CFW, and whatever else that may encompass, and the big VGF flash sale this summer followed by underwhelming RIV/AUL incentives I guess I’m left feeling a bit disenamored and disappointed overall.

DVC, for us was a large purchase we put a lot of consideration into, but it was reassuring to feel at the end of the day integrity and honesty were a cornerstone of what Disney is founded upon. We are looking to add on more direct points, but now I question if I asked my guide a question if I would get an honest answer, or at least an honest admission that my question couldn’t be answered yet. Instead, the current culture of evasiveness is wearing on my trust and the overall positive mentality that Disney often fills for me.

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

 

[SL6827]

Ok, I will admit I am probably overly optimistic boarding on naive, don’t readily embrace change, and realize that at the end of the day DVC is a time share sales, but all that aside I am struggling with the recent evasiveness from DVD.

Our family loves vacationing at Disney and have shared some wonderful times together there. Sure, some trips have been more magical than others, but that is to be expected. And I fully understand Disney has needed to make changes along the way over the last few years and that the perks and benefits could come and go. But at the end of the day, we trusted that the questions we had about DVC were explained with a reasonable degree of transparency so we subsequently understood the product we had decided to allocate much of our disposable income to.

But now, I find myself bothered by the lack of communication from DVD when asked specific questions about what was mentioned at the annual meeting regarding the new Poly tower. Add to that somewhat mixed messaging about restrictions, all of the workings over the last few months to set up the trust for CFW, and whatever else that may encompass, and the big VGF flash sale this summer followed by underwhelming RIV/AUL incentives I guess I’m left feeling a bit disenamored and disappointed overall.

DVC, for us was a large purchase we put a lot of consideration into, but it was reassuring to feel at the end of the day integrity and honesty were a cornerstone of what Disney is founded upon. We are looking to add on more direct points, but now I question if I asked my guide a question if I would get an honest answer, or at least an honest admission that my question couldn’t be answered yet. Instead, the current culture of evasiveness is wearing on my trust and the overall positive mentality that Disney often fills for me.

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

On spot.

 

[Sammie]

If I did not trust them I would sell. I think they tell as much as they are allowed to either by law or management above them.

 

[MerlinandtheMouse]

I think being very active here on the disboards (at least being an active voyeur) really gets in my head and although I love the analyzing and sometimes over analyzing of all things DVC and Disney, it does take away some of the magic.

I’m a fairly new DVC member (Feb 1 is our 1 year anniversary!), in my early thirties and not your typical Disney fan that grew up going to the Disney parks. We only started going to the parks in the last 5 or 6 years but quickly fell in love and I happily dragged my sister into joining with me (I figured no matter where our lives take us, we’d always have each other so who better to do this DVC thing with).

All this to say, we don’t know the Disney/DVC that most here grew up on. I feel like I see so much negativity lately surrounding the changes that Disney and DVC have made over the years and it’s jarring in the face of how much joy it brings us. It makes me question a lot and sometimes leaves me disenchanted like you’ve said. But I have to remind myself that that’s not fair. Nostalgia plays a huge role in how people feel about Disney and when time passes and change happens, as it will inevitably do, not everyone is happy with those changes because it strays from their happier memories but those changes also create a world of memories for younger/different generations of Disney lovers. And yes, DVC has changed, some for the worse, but definitely some for the better but we all get so stuck on the worse.

My sister is happy in her ignorance of everything that is dissected here in these chats and forums and it’s not as if the product is any more or less different than what I’m experiencing but she’s not bogged down with all the comments and nitpicking that sometimes goes on here. It’s good to be aware of what you’ve paid into, but also sometimes just enjoy it for what it is not all the things it was and could be. Disney is still so magical and still very much the happiest place. But if it stops being that for you, then let that be because of how you perceive and experience it, and not how us hyper aware and overly (if often, rightfully) critical Disboarders are.

Ultimately, I don’t disagree with what you’re saying. This current era of DVC is a bit of a mess and maybe not where we want to see the company going but like all great companies who are beholden to their members and loyal fans (not to mention stockholders!), they’ll fumble through their mistakes and correct them in due time. Surely we’ve seen them go through slumps before but they’ve always managed to find their way again, even if it looks a bit different from what we remembered. That’s what I’m choosing to believe anyway, naive or not.

 

[maui22]

I can live with perk changes and guides not being willing or able to answer questions about some things.

What bothers me is RIV started restrictions not that long ago. Now we have the trust changing everything again. For a product with roughly a 50
year purchase lifespan, does Disney really plan to change it dramatically every 5 years? If DW and I imagined Disney would go hog wild like this, highly unlikely we would have ever purchased. would have saved us a lot of money.

 

[AstroBlasters]

Ok, I will admit I am probably overly optimistic boarding on naive, don’t readily embrace change, and realize that at the end of the day DVC is a time share sales, but all that aside I am struggling with the recent evasiveness from DVD.

Our family loves vacationing at Disney and have shared some wonderful times together there. Sure, some trips have been more magical than others, but that is to be expected. And I fully understand Disney has needed to make changes along the way over the last few years and that the perks and benefits could come and go. But at the end of the day, we trusted that the questions we had about DVC were explained with a reasonable degree of transparency so we subsequently understood the product we had decided to allocate much of our disposable income to.

But now, I find myself bothered by the lack of communication from DVD when asked specific questions about what was mentioned at the annual meeting regarding the new Poly tower. Add to that somewhat mixed messaging about restrictions, all of the workings over the last few months to set up the trust for CFW, and whatever else that may encompass, and the big VGF flash sale this summer followed by underwhelming RIV/AUL incentives I guess I’m left feeling a bit disenamored and disappointed overall.

DVC, for us was a large purchase we put a lot of consideration into, but it was reassuring to feel at the end of the day integrity and honesty were a cornerstone of what Disney is founded upon. We are looking to add on more direct points, but now I question if I asked my guide a question if I would get an honest answer, or at least an honest admission that my question couldn’t be answered yet. Instead, the current culture of evasiveness is wearing on my trust and the overall positive mentality that Disney often fills for me.

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

When your words carry legal ramifications you try to be as clear as you can while leaving room for the uncertainty that can occur before everything is finalized. That’s all it is.

 

[DanCali]

Ok, I will admit I am probably overly optimistic boarding on naive, don’t readily embrace change, and realize that at the end of the day DVC is a time share sales, but all that aside I am struggling with the recent evasiveness from DVD.

Our family loves vacationing at Disney and have shared some wonderful times together there. Sure, some trips have been more magical than others, but that is to be expected. And I fully understand Disney has needed to make changes along the way over the last few years and that the perks and benefits could come and go. But at the end of the day, we trusted that the questions we had about DVC were explained with a reasonable degree of transparency so we subsequently understood the product we had decided to allocate much of our disposable income to.

But now, I find myself bothered by the lack of communication from DVD when asked specific questions about what was mentioned at the annual meeting regarding the new Poly tower. Add to that somewhat mixed messaging about restrictions, all of the workings over the last few months to set up the trust for CFW, and whatever else that may encompass, and the big VGF flash sale this summer followed by underwhelming RIV/AUL incentives I guess I’m left feeling a bit disenamored and disappointed overall.

DVC, for us was a large purchase we put a lot of consideration into, but it was reassuring to feel at the end of the day integrity and honesty were a cornerstone of what Disney is founded upon. We are looking to add on more direct points, but now I question if I asked my guide a question if I would get an honest answer, or at least an honest admission that my question couldn’t be answered yet. Instead, the current culture of evasiveness is wearing on my trust and the overall positive mentality that Disney often fills for me.

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

It doesn't bother me because I'm used to a lot worse... Being a timeshare owner pre-DVC for 15+ years, and sitting in many 90+ minute high pressure presentations, I heard a lot of bs/excuses/stories/lies over the years. I learned the first rule of timeshare ownership: buy resale - unless you have a very good and educated reason to buy direct. We took the same approach with DVC, but also had good reasons to buy direct in the past year due to very good promotions that made the delta relative to resale prices minimal. I have a good relationship with our guide and she's been a straight shooter.

My general view is:

If the direct prices/promos are not good enough for you, don't buy direct.
If you think that resale restrictions will destroy resale values, and it bothers you, don't buy direct.
If you don't trust what you are being told, don't buy direct.
If you don't trust the Trust product, don't buy the Trust product
But... after all that
If you have a good reason to buy direct, then buy direct, but don't hesitate to cancel in the first 10 days if you have regrets

At this point, I just look forward to enjoying many years of vacations with what we have. We have another contract to add (delayed close) and then we're done for the foreseeable future. If I ever want to add something and I don't like the current/new offerings for any reason then there are plenty of options on the resale market - BLT, VGF, and Poly1 are great options for the next 35-40 years (and our horizon is shorter than that...). Resale is easy, transparent, and not going away anytime soon!

 

[AstroBlasters]

It doesn't bother me because I'm used to a lot worse... Being a timeshare owner pre-DVC for 15+ years, and sitting in many 90+ minutes high pressure presentations, I heard a lot of bs/excuses/stories/lies over the years. I learned the first rule of timeshare ownership: buy resale - unless you have a very good and educated reason to buy direct. We took the same approach with DVC, but also had good reasons to buy direct in the past year due to very good promotions that made the delta relative to resale prices minimal. I have a good relationship with our guide and she's been a straight shooter.

My general view is:

If the direct prices/promos are not good enough for you, don't buy direct.
If you think that resale restrictions will destroy resale values, and it bothers you, don't buy direct.
If you don't trust what you are being told, don't buy direct.
If you don't trust the Trust product, don't buy the Trust product
But... after all that
If you have a good reason to buy direct, then buy direct, but don't hesitate to cancel in the first 10 days if you have regrets

At this point, I just look forward to enjoying many years of vacations with what we have. We have another contract to add (delayed close) and then we're done for the foreseeable future. If I ever want to add something and I don't like the current/new offerings for any reason then there are plenty of options on the resale market - BLT, VGF, and Poly1 are great options for us for the next 35-40 years. Resale is easy, transparent, and not going away anytime soon!

 

[walt34]

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

Don't let this stress you out. DVD has, at this point, given us very little information on what is actually going to happen. Therefore you can find a lot of speculation and forensic interpretation of filings and of what has and hasn't been said in meetings on these boards. We don't know which changes will actually be implemented (if any).

If you enjoy some speculation and 'what if' scenarios, keep reading. I personally find it fascinating - a bit like solving a puzzle. But if you don't and it stresses you out, I'd recommend not following these discussions here. You'll worry about scenarios that will never happen while others actually do happen and it is probably early enough to worry about these once they become official.

Just never assume that your DVC contract will give you anything in the future that you don't have in writing. And don't assume that things stay the same. Have a look a booking patterns - even without major changes like multi-site trusts, booking patterns do change and what seemed to be an easy booking at 7 months might not be next year. There is no guarantee for things to stay the same.

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

Ok, I will admit I am probably overly optimistic boarding on naive, don’t readily embrace change, and realize that at the end of the day DVC is a time share sales, but all that aside I am struggling with the recent evasiveness from DVD.

Our family loves vacationing at Disney and have shared some wonderful times together there. Sure, some trips have been more magical than others, but that is to be expected. And I fully understand Disney has needed to make changes along the way over the last few years and that the perks and benefits could come and go. But at the end of the day, we trusted that the questions we had about DVC were explained with a reasonable degree of transparency so we subsequently understood the product we had decided to allocate much of our disposable income to.

But now, I find myself bothered by the lack of communication from DVD when asked specific questions about what was mentioned at the annual meeting regarding the new Poly tower. Add to that somewhat mixed messaging about restrictions, all of the workings over the last few months to set up the trust for CFW, and whatever else that may encompass, and the big VGF flash sale this summer followed by underwhelming RIV/AUL incentives I guess I’m left feeling a bit disenamored and disappointed overall.

DVC, for us was a large purchase we put a lot of consideration into, but it was reassuring to feel at the end of the day integrity and honesty were a cornerstone of what Disney is founded upon. We are looking to add on more direct points, but now I question if I asked my guide a question if I would get an honest answer, or at least an honest admission that my question couldn’t be answered yet. Instead, the current culture of evasiveness is wearing on my trust and the overall positive mentality that Disney often fills for me.

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

Yes Disney has become slimy. It is amazing that the product is still as good as it is. We would have purchased more points too if Disney wasn’t such a mess.

 

[walt34]

Yes Disney has become slimy. It is amazing that the product is still as good as it is. We would have purchased more points too if Disney wasn’t such a mess.

Remember when Michael Eisner was seen as the villain (inspiring Shrek's Lord Farquaad) who destroyed the Disney values? Nowadays, DVC members especially seem to remember this as the golden age.

People seem to forget that 'Disney 100' celebrated Disney's 100th anniversary - as a company.

 

[DVCanadian]

Ok, I will admit I am probably overly optimistic boarding on naive, don’t readily embrace change, and realize that at the end of the day DVC is a time share sales, but all that aside I am struggling with the recent evasiveness from DVD.

Our family loves vacationing at Disney and have shared some wonderful times together there. Sure, some trips have been more magical than others, but that is to be expected. And I fully understand Disney has needed to make changes along the way over the last few years and that the perks and benefits could come and go. But at the end of the day, we trusted that the questions we had about DVC were explained with a reasonable degree of transparency so we subsequently understood the product we had decided to allocate much of our disposable income to.

But now, I find myself bothered by the lack of communication from DVD when asked specific questions about what was mentioned at the annual meeting regarding the new Poly tower. Add to that somewhat mixed messaging about restrictions, all of the workings over the last few months to set up the trust for CFW, and whatever else that may encompass, and the big VGF flash sale this summer followed by underwhelming RIV/AUL incentives I guess I’m left feeling a bit disenamored and disappointed overall.

DVC, for us was a large purchase we put a lot of consideration into, but it was reassuring to feel at the end of the day integrity and honesty were a cornerstone of what Disney is founded upon. We are looking to add on more direct points, but now I question if I asked my guide a question if I would get an honest answer, or at least an honest admission that my question couldn’t be answered yet. Instead, the current culture of evasiveness is wearing on my trust and the overall positive mentality that Disney often fills for me.

Am I overreacting and blowing current situation out of proportion or, given the magnitude of money a DVC contract costs, is anyone else feeling frustrated by the current evasiveness and how that impacts their comfort purchasing?

I think you might be over reacting, or the pixie dust is wearing off, or being scraped off by the echo chamber discussions here. I have no idea how underwhelming discounts impact you but incentives go in cycles. Prices fluctuate.
DVD and Disney are businesses they don’t owe us answers to every speculation on a message board. Guides can’t tell you things that haven’t been announced yet, that is the job of the bus drivers

We all prepaid for a hotel room.
You are still getting what you paid for. I can’t imagine anything has changed related to what you purchased.
It will be ok.

 

[walt34]

Guides can’t tell you things that haven’t been announced yet, that is the job of the bus drivers

Is there anyone here who bought direct and was not told the bus driver's personal DVC history? I've always wondered whether this is a longstanding tradition, handed down from bus driver to bus driver, or part of the official DVC sales playbook.

 

[WDWFERN]

Thanks everyone! I agree I likely got stuck in my head tossing around a bunch of what ifs. I’m not awesome with unknowns, so this will be a good growth moment for me! I appreciate the overall perspective and will stay hopeful we will learn more in the months ahead. Thanks again all!!

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

Remember when Michael Eisner was seen as the villain (inspiring Shrek's Lord Farquaad) who destroyed the Disney values? Nowadays, DVC members especially seem to remember this as the golden age.

People seem to forget that 'Disney 100' celebrated Disney's 100th anniversary - as a company.

I loved Michael Eisner when he was CEO. He actually liked Disney. I don’t know who these people are who disliked him. The Shrek thing was produced by a disgruntled Disney exec who left— katzenberg. I never liked Walt’s nephew. Total loser. I did like Walt’s son in law though.

 

[lowlight]

When they shamefully quickly flipped the BPK into VGF, I knew it was the beginning of the end for me. Now we have the ugly Poly tower and moderate level CFW coming with possibly a trust setup. I am going to give it time to play out before making a rash decision, but I have lost all confidence in DVD and Disney as a whole to preserve their products value, and will likely sell my 3 contracts and rent points when I decide to go. Some people expect the absolute bare minimum from companies and are happy when they get just a room. Those are the ideal customers for DVC, “thank you sir may I have another” comes to mind.

 

[walt34]

I loved Michael Eisner when he was CEO. He actually liked Disney. I don’t know who these people are who disliked him. The Shrek thing was produced by a disgruntled Disney exec who left— katzenberg. I never liked Walt’s nephew. Total loser. I did like Walt’s son in law though.

Oh, I like a lot of what Eisner did but also a lot of what Iger did. And there is stuff I don't like with both CEOs.

My point was that Eisner was criticised when he as CEO as being greedy and not understanding the Disney values by many as is Iger today. But Disney hasn't just recently become a corporation. It's decision have been focusing on profitability for a long time. Some decision are just better than others.

 

[lowlight]

It's decision have been focusing on profitability for a long time. Some decision are just better than others.

That’s the thing that scares me. They are focusing on profitability and failing miserably. There is definitely internal pressure to go lean and maximize profits and that’s when poorly though out short term money making schemes get approved.

 

[walt34]

When they shamefully quickly flipped the BPK into VGF, I knew it was the beginning of the end for me. Now we have the ugly Poly tower and moderate level CFW coming with possibly a trust setup. I am going to give it time to play out before making a rash decision, but I have lost all confidence in DVD and Disney as a whole to preserve their products value, and will likely sell my 3 contracts and rent points when I decide to go. Some people expect the absolute bare minimum from companies and are happy when they get just a room. Those are the ideal customers for DVC, “thank you sir may I have another” comes to mind.

I quite like the BPK rooms and I reject your implication that this makes my standards inferior to yours. I also don't like the CFW, because they would not fit my needs, but I see quite a few people who are interested in them. Just because I like VGF (and BPK) and somebody else (who possibly has more positive associations with trailer camping than I do) prefers CFW doesn't make them subservient customers.

DVC has covered a broad range of tastes for quite some time.

 

[lowlight]

I quite like the BPK rooms and I reject your implication that this makes my standards inferior to yours.

I wasn’t referring to you, I was referring to those who like to jump on these posts with a “you only paid for a room” argument. Companies have broad contracts and terms of service, and if those companies only provided the bare minimum or utilized all their implied and stated rights, all consumers would be miserable and so I don’t give Disney a pass because they are Disney. As for BPK, opinions about the desirability are neither right nor wrong, but the obvious intention of DVD was to cheaply and quickly flip the building, which was more my point. Whether one likes the outcome doesn’t change the fact that it was done for that reason.