Disney Riviera Resort

[nkosiek]

Transportation at WL was an issue a couple weeks ago. Not only did we share with Contemporary, but also with The Fort for Epcot and MK. Only the early morning busses did not share- once you hit 9 am you were sharing. Plus, they were running about every 45-50 mins both at WL and the parks- except for MK. Sat at Epcot and watched 3 SSR busses come and go before ONE WL bus arrived. PLUS, we saw very bad guest behavior- making out on the bus (and then some), a literal coming to blows fight between 2 women, incredibly scantily clad girls making not so veiled innuendos between the carrots they were eating and some body parts... I have never seen it as bad as that, and I attribute some of it to the less frequent/more packed busses. Not a very "deluxe" feel to be sure.

Unless they have more reliable dedicated busses AND the gondolas work as they are being hyped to, it will not warrant the cost they are hoping for as a deluxe. Also a reason we won't even contemplate buying CCR right now- Disney is focusing more on profit than "magic". They are letting the small details go. If DRR is in the same boat, I don't think that bodes well.

ETA: @Roxyfire I am typically like you, and know the busses can take time. I am usually patient, but this last trip put me over the edge. It was SO much worse.

Yeah, last Thurday around 9:30-10:40 at the Contemporary there were 2 buses to AK at slightly over an hour (that I know of). We missed the first due to the number of people in front of us and the second was just as packed and people missed that one. Saw 4 Springs buses in that time and only 1 for Studios @ 9:55, without another arrival listed on the board when we departed at 10:35.

Normally, I don't mind the buses. Am from a large city and have done public transit since I was in 5th grade, but sometimes they just don't seem to get it right down there, and Thursday is one where I went to the AK bus people and dropped a note of complaint off.

 

[umichigan10]

Didn't you hear there will be a fence around it?

I just don't see how they sell it as the "new BLT" when its not even close

Yeah I mean is it gonna be connected to a deluxe resort that not only is iconic, by has amenities for such a level resort and a walking path to he magic kingdom? Exactly

 

[umichigan10]

Don't disagree, I just feel the portion highlighted in Bold will be an even bigger question when it's tied to a moderate resort.

It just doesn't make any sense if it's charged what it's going to be. But people will probably still buy

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

It just doesn't make any sense if it's charged what it's going to be. But people will probably still buy

We don't know what they're charging per point yet, right?

 

[LSLS]

If you think Disney could get away with charging 300 dollars for the shoe-boxes that are Pop Century rooms, you're crazy. There is NOTHING at AoA or POP that justifies that price point for their rooms (I said rooms, not suites). And nothing in the rumors/planning would begin to tackle that gap. No restaurant announcements, the new rooms at POP look better but certainly aren't deluxe/moderate in level of finishes (look at new Coronado rooms as comparison).

Maybe. Though I remember staying at the Pop for like $75 a night 10 years ago, and a quick rack rate look shows rack rates as high as $225. You add the direct line, it wouldn't shock me one bit.

On a bit of a different note, what does this mean for the Caribbean? Just looking at that structure, you have to be looking at like an 9-10 story hotel next to the Caribbean. Themed like (I'm assuming) the French Riviera, or at least just a random luxury hotel. With a gondola cutting straight through it. How is the theme going to work?

 

[umichigan10]

We don't know what they're charging per point yet, right?

Nope absolutely speculation on my end. I'm hoping they charge a more middle ground amount but I'm worried they'll try and charge it BLT points. Guess we'll see

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Nope absolutely speculation on my end. I'm hoping they charge a more middle ground amount but I'm worried they'll try and charge it BLT points. Guess we'll see

Got it. Yeah -- when I first watched the D23 announcement I thought that point value may be reasonable. When I saw more detail about where it is, access to parks being via gondola, etc., it seems like BLT level is a stretch. We're owners at BLT and from what I understand now, I would not consider them on par value-wise.

If reviews are good, I can totally see staying there once during F&W if we could get a reservation, just to check it out. I wouldn't buy there a this point, though. But IF the gondola system proves REALLY EFFICIENT, I could see going back using our SSR points that we've never unloaded... ...

 

[umichigan10]

Got it. Yeah -- when I first watched the D23 announcement I thought that point value may be reasonable. When I saw more detail about where it is, access to parks being via gondola, etc., it seems like BLT level is a stretch. We're owners at BLT and from what I understand now, I would not consider them on par value-wise.

If reviews are good, I can totally see staying there once during F&W if we could get a reservation, just to check it out. I wouldn't buy there a this point, though. But IF the gondola system proves REALLY EFFICIENT, I could see going back using our SSR points that we've never unloaded... ...

I think it has potential to be really nice but I think the numbers have to be realistic. If that's the case then I'm all for it

 

[Andrew015]

My money is on it being the same or within $10/point of Poly/Copper Creek. Discounting the price to be commensurate with the resort that it's tied to probably creates more problems than not discounting at all.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I just looked up number of points required for weeklong stays and I'm surprised at how high Copper Creek and Boulder Ridge are -- just a tiny bit less than BLT standard view. I can't ever see picking one of those over being able to walk to MK.

If they follow a similar model for DRR, seems like they'll price it just under BC & BW, no? Which is also similar to BLT standard view. With the main difference being the volume of people DRR is sharing transportation with, I think... and I guess not being "connected" to a "deluxe" with those amenities.

I dunno... will be interesting to see.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Doubt it. Only reason BWV and BCV are so low for points/night is because they're nearly original DVC. Once declared, total points for a resort are fixed.

Total points for this one will be higher, and the price per night as well.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Doubt it. Only reason BWV and BCV are so low for points/night is because they're nearly original DVC. Once declared, total points for a resort are fixed.

Total points for this one will be higher, and the price per night as well.

Not sure I get what you mean... Points for a week stay at BC and BW are a little less than what standard view and BLT is.

But BLT purchase price was higher. Is this what you mean?

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Not sure I get what you mean... Points for a week stay at BC and BW are a little less than what standard view and BLT is.

But BLT purchase price was higher. Is this what you mean?

Standard at BLT is a fairly small category. BLT LV is really the category to look at for a median point value. However, what I was saying is more that BWV was the second DVC opened on-property (4th overall) and BCV was the fourth. (VWL, now BRV was third.) Buy-in was certainly much lower at the time, but it was still very much a new product.

Dates:

• OKW: 1991
• BWV: 1996
• BRV: 2000
• BCV: 2002

BLT was opened in 2009 - and Saratoga and AKV came in between. Saratoga and AKV are both really big resorts, with a much higher total points sold. BLT is big, too.

By that time, there was much more of a pattern of 7 month demand. As every new resort has opened since, 7 month switch pressure has increased. At this point, Disney knows how popular both BCV and BWV are. They'd love to charge more per night at each, but because of how points-per-resort works, that number is fixed in time, and cannot be changed.

CCV has maintained a fairly low points-per-night, but because of its neighbor BRV, I think they'd have had a hard time doing otherwise. But buy-in is $176/point, which is higher than Poly was at declaration.

Riviera is going to likely be costlier in points per night (more points to sell) than BCV and BWV, and buy-in won't be any lower than CCV.

 

[Keels]

I'm planning on point $ to be similar to what is currently available direct from Disney (not Aulani) and point expenditure to be at least that of BCV.

All in.

 

[Capang]

How telling is it that the Poly (second only to the Grand in terms of "luxury") is outselling Copper Creek 3:1? Some part of this is probably due to the fact that the Poly has such a strong following (but then ago, so does the Lodge), but also, informed buyers can purchase Boulder Ridge (aka original WL) via resale at a fraction of the cost and receive the same amenities. Having said that, I would argue that most DVC buyers aren't even aware that the resale market exists to begin with, so it can't be moving the needle that much. Long story short, if they're having a tough time selling Copper Creek, which is a legitimate deluxe in every sense of the word, they better have some tricks up their sleeves to pawn off Riveria Royale on the masses...

View attachment 254186

To be fair, DVC guides are really, REALLY pushing Poly. Sat through a DVC sales meeting in June and had to ask twice about CC when all they wanted to tell me was how great Poly was. So sure Poly is outselling cc, but that might be intentional at this time. Sell all the Poly so they can work on cc sales then on to riveria.

 

[umichigan10]

To be fair, DVC guides are really, REALLY pushing Poly. Sat through a DVC sales meeting in June and had to ask twice about CC when all they wanted to tell me was how great Poly was. So sure Poly is outselling cc, but that might be intentional at this time. Sell all the Poly so they can work on cc sales then on to riveria.

I feel like if that's the case they're gonna outpace what they can sell. I don't know how much of the poly has sold, but there's so many more units they have to sell off at copper creek and now riviera? Will be really interesting (nevermind the aulani points still sitting there)

 

[amberpi]

I'm sorry if I'm just dense, but is all we know so far that there will be one (seemingly gorgeous) restaurant?

 

[rteetz]

I'm sorry if I'm just dense, but is all we know so far that there will be one (seemingly gorgeous) restaurant?

And a gondola station connected.

 

[amberpi]

And a gondola station connected.

Lol, I got it. I've got PTSD from the SW hotel of my dreams being dashed

 

[tjkraz]

How telling is it that the Poly (second only to the Grand in terms of "luxury") is outselling Copper Creek 3:1? Some part of this is probably due to the fact that the Poly has such a strong following (but then ago, so does the Lodge), but also, informed buyers can purchase Boulder Ridge (aka original WL) via resale at a fraction of the cost and receive the same amenities. Having said that, I would argue that most DVC buyers aren't even aware that the resale market exists to begin with, so it can't be moving the needle that much. Long story short, if they're having a tough time selling Copper Creek, which is a legitimate deluxe in every sense of the word, they better have some tricks up their sleeves to pawn off Riveria Royale on the masses...

Copper Creek is going to be an interesting one to follow.

The Poly comparison isn't particularly troubling because DVC sales reps are pushing the "buy Poly now or lose out" button pretty hard. At this rate, it will be legitimately "sold out" by November or December. But remember the same thing pretty much happened 2-3 years ago when Poly was starting and Grand Floridian wrapping-up. In the first 3 months selling simultaneously, VGF sold 365k points to 149k for Polynesian.

That said, Copper Creek has started even slower than Poly. You're right...many newbies don't know about resale. But current members do. DVC didn't get that initial rush of owners anxious to add-on at Copper Creek. And now they'll spend 2 years battling the resale market, high dues for Copper Creek and the Riviera announcement.

As a whole, DVC is doing quite well. The first half of calendar 2017 was their best since 2012. I don't think Copper Creek can sustain that momentum. Question is how much things will drop off.

As for Riviera, I seem to be more optimistic than many people. I expect Disney to do an impressive job of building up that CBR/DRR area. I think it will be like a smaller scale version of the Crescent Lake area where BC/YC/BW are all grouped together. Caribbean Beach and Riviera will both have restaurants, shops and amenities which appeal to guests. It will be easy to walk back and forth between the two. The gondola transport will be popular, especially to Hollywood Studios as Star Wars land opens.

Having Riviera across the lake from a "moderate" creates a perception they will need to overcome, but I don't know how much it will truly matter to a guest staying in deluxe rooms with a deluxe pool and deluxe dining.

It's interesting that a similar tower is going into CSR (rooftop lounge with "spectacular views", tower), but they didn't do DVC with it.

Coronado Springs is targeted at convention business. Besides, they don't need another DVC right now.