Looking for Advice....

Don't be so sure. Under most circumstances yes. After the death of a spouse? That's different. Many decisions are made under that kind of duress and it seems that the op mom may have made one. In fairness the op as well.

I've known many ladies widowed and no one was swindled by their kids. Sure it happens but probably the exception not the rule.

OP says that is NOT the case here. Why not stop adding in what you THINK happened and just listen to the OP>

To the OP - now I realize that the addition was your inheritance I don't think you owe anything to your Mom financially. If she can afford to winter south every year she can afford to support herself.
 
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I'm sure my dad would love to switch situations with you. My 93 year old grandmother refuses to live with anyone even though she's not capable of living alone.

I would suggest a family meeting with your mom and all your siblings so that a housing change for your mom can be discussed openly, caringly, and respectfully. It seems odd to me that you've only discussed this with your husband. Unless your mother is incapacitated, she should be included in all the discussions about where she is going to live.
This post makes the most sense out of all posts, IMO. Have a FAMILY meeting with mom and all siblings. OP's siblings need to step up and everyone needs to be involved in the decision making, including mom.
 
This post makes the most sense out of all posts, IMO. Have a FAMILY meeting with mom and all siblings. OP's siblings need to step up and everyone needs to be involved in the decision making, including mom.

I agree. Especially since everyone benefitted in some way financially from Mom selling the house and dispersing the proceeds 19 years ago. Did no one consider that Mom would need a good chunk of money to continue caring for herself as she aged or was it assumed and understood that by moving in with OP she would be taken care of for the rest of her life? At 54, she could conceivably have been just over halfway through her her life with 40 years left to live and support herself. If everyone took money from Mom in some shape or form 19 years ago, then everyone needs to be in conversation now about what Mom is owed as she faces having to live on her own again for the first time in 19 years.
 
I've known many ladies widowed and no one was swindled by their kids. Sure it happens but probably the exception not the rule.

OP says that is NOT the case here. Why not stopping adding in what you THINK happened and just listen to the OP>

I did listen. The op said the sibs split the money from moms house. Her share was the addition. The living arrangements were to be permanent and the proceeds from the increased house would be hers upon mom's death. Op and her dh no longer want to honor the agreement. Husband feels nothing should go to mom because the siblings already got their share. Mom loses.

Now as to vulnerable widows. I'm sure you know people who have lost a spouse. I am one of those people. There us a vast difference between having a support system that help save you through that awful first year without making some very disastrous decisions and a group of people who want to profit from those decisions. I am not saying the op and her siblings deliberately pushed mom into that decision, but depending on how mom was coping with her husbands death, it may have been easy to assist her in this decision.
 
Ohhh good grief.... Seriously???
Moon... I said long term residency. then I just mentioned 'similar to squatter's rights'...

Sorry if there is some confusion or some issues with reading and comprehension.
But, hey.... nice try!!!!!

I've noticed this is a common theme for your posts. How is it possible that everyone here has a problem with reading comprehension? It's definitely a head scratcher to say the least. :scratchin

Since you keep harping on paying the extra real estate taxes you paid, did you also use the entire real estate tax deduction on your taxes? The additional deduction you received on your mother's apartment would also have to be deducted from what you say you are owed for taking in your mother.

You better make sure you have all your legal ducks in a row before you kick your mother to the 55+ residence without reimbursing her. As I mentioned before, once she starts telling her fellow residents how her lifestyle has diminished and how she invested in a property, you can bet there will be plenty of savvy residents who will encourage her to look at what she is legally (emotionally aside) entitled to from you.

I hope someone is looking out for her & points her in the right direction for the legal help she's apparently going to need.
 
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I think as a mother myself I would realize circumstances change and want my children to be happy.
Without actually being privy to the entire laid bare situation it's a bit of a blanket statement there. There are many factors involved here. I think most people would probably have a shock if one day the person (whoever that may be) that they were living with up and decided you're no longer part of the equation with respects to the living arrangements. Would it have been prudent to have saved $$ while living with one of her children? Perhaps but then again straight from the OP's mouth it was always a permanent thing.

I don't entirely disagree with you but nor do I fully agree with you either. There's a lot of unknown things that I don't expect to know/understand, etc. I'm not in that family, I don't know the OP at all and frankly nor should this conversation truly be had on the internet--it should be face to face with the person the OP has openly admitted they avoid.
 
I really not planned on getting into this great of detail on the intimate details of my family dynamics, but so many of you seem to think that my siblings and I are all a bunch of evil and no good. My mother has always had trouble with simple tasks like I said in my previous posts. Be it setting an alarm clock, changing a light bulb, stupid mundane tasks that I can't even think of right now. My father took care of it all. He also did the grocery shopping and drove her to work everyday. This wasn't something that anyone ever approached her about, but we knew that for whatever reason-she had trouble with these kinds of things. I don't know if there is a term for it or a diagnosis-but again, it just is. When I mention my mother being a manipulator-this isn't meant to classify her as evil. This is a defense mechanism as well. If she doesn't know how to do a simple task-she doesn't tell you she doesn't know how to do it. She has mastered a way to work around it so you don't catch on that she doesn't know how to do something. If you're not around her enough-you probably wouldn't even know that you were being manipulated. One of her workarounds when it comes to setting her alarm clock if she has an early appointment is to ask you to check on her if you don't hear her up in the morning. Just silly little things like that. If you push the issue and say why don't you set your alarm clock? She will immediately get defensive and raise her voice, etc. so that you will just do as she asked.

When my father died-we we're all in a panic. They didn't have senior communities 19 years ago like they do now. Besides-she wasn't a senior. She knew she couldn't live on her own even though she didn't come right out and say it-and we knew it as well. She couldn't set her clock to get up in the morning, she couldn't drive her self to work, etc. When I mentioned the possibility of her moving in with me-she jumped on it and never considered any other options. For a time, it looked like it might not happen due to zoning laws and such. She was even more panicked. I realize this is not normal for most 54 year-olds and certainly not for myself. Nobody was thinking clearly and certainly nobody was looking to swindle my mother out of anything. We were young, in mourning and panicked. This seemed like the best idea at the time. Obviously it was not. When I say she thought it was permanent-that's because nobody discussed terms, alternate plans, etc. What if my husband and I got divorced? What if one of us passed away? What if job situations changed, etc. Nothing was discussed. She was just thrilled to have her immediate problem solved. When I say I thought it was permanent-I meant that I thought this was our forever home. Just like when people get married-they assume it's forever-sometimes it's not.

The situation was not good from the start. As I also mentioned previously. But, I couldn't afford to buy her out and I wasn't going to put her out. So we dealt with it. I wonder at times if she even thinks she should have done something different but felt the same way I did-that everything was already done. I never moved her in to be a babysitter-she worked herself. I'm not looking to bash her and say she never did a thing for me-but she was not my house cleaner, baby sitter, cook or whatever.

Once she retired, she started to winter in the South. She was still left with a nice nest egg and she used her savings to do this. She does not have enough income coming in to replenish the savings. She has been doing this for about 13 years now. I do not know what she has left.

When she winters in the south, she stays in a retirement community. She loves it and looks forward to this time every year. She participates in activities, hangs out at the pool, has a card night, etc. She cannot afford to live there year-round. I thought that she would be happier in something like that here, but would never initiate the move on her own due to financial concerns.

So going forward-I have three choices: We can all continue to live here with the changes to the neighborhood; I can move and bring her with me to a home that is secluded, harder for her to get out and about from and doesn't provide the amount of living space that she has now; or I can move and she can move into the retirement community

She will not be abandoned and dropped off like trash at the retirement community. Really people, I've said multiple times that I will help her and see to it that all of her needs are met. She is and will always be a part of my family-but I don't think that means she has to physically live with me.
 
appleplie, you are doing fine. You have done nothing wrong. You are trying to come up with some plans before you talk to your mom about choices. I see nothing wrong with that. I also haven't seen anything in your posts that implies you are just going to dump your mom and run - or that you're trying to gain financially from her. Good grief. Just ignore all of us. I think you seem perfectly reasonable to me, you don't need the grief you are getting, and you're certainly not getting support from most here in what is I'm sure a difficult dilemma for you.

IMO, your original ideas make sense. Next step is to bring mom and then your sibs into the decision making process. You don't need us adding to your anxiety about this.

For many of us the DIS is a place we think is safe to work through dilemmas that are overwhelming us. We weren't that for you. My apologies for what we're putting you through.
 
Sorry OP that people are making you feel bad. It does sound like mother wasn't a typical 54 year old woman. Thanks for the clarification. Your situation seems much more unique now. Sorry I compared her to others like my Mom that were much more independent individuals.
At age 54 you and your siblings must have been fairly young at the time of your father's death so it does make sense how it all turned out.

I think a senior's centre makes sense for your Mom at this point too. It's too bad that the decision to give the money from her home away was made at the time.
 
I think it's really unfortunate that you can't sit down with your mom and talk about this. You do not have to have any solutions at this point. It may be best to be honest and say you're conflicted and don't know what's fair to her, and then ask her what she thinks is a fair solution if the house is sold.
 
Just stop it, people, with all of the judgements. If you don't have anything helpful to say, don't say anything at all.

Op - you don't owe anybody else any additional sort of explanation. In fact, I would recommend that you walk away from this thread and don't respond.
 
Just stop it, people, with all of the judgements. If you don't have anything helpful to say, don't say anything at all.
.

I always find it interesting to see that after somone posts for opinions on a public message board, and after the discussion turns to anything other than support and pixie dust, posters are told that they must remain within a "helpful" framework.
 
Just stop it, people, with all of the judgements. If you don't have anything helpful to say, don't say anything at all.

Op - you don't owe anybody else any additional sort of explanation. In fact, I would recommend that you walk away from this thread and don't respond.

Since the OP is, and I quote the thread title, "Looking for Advice", perhaps you should mind your own business and not try decide what is helpful and what is not? If the thread is bothering YOU that much maybe YOU should "walk away from this thread and don't respond"? Sorry, I just don't get posts like this.

Anyway, I am glad you have a back up plan for your mother and that you truly believe she will enjoy herself in that 55+ community. But yes it does seem odd that you had her move in with you since she could not be alone at age 54, and are then making her leave to go on her own at 74...just seems a bit backwards. But if you handle it with compassion and fairness it should go fine.

However, I think you and your siblings made some poor choices. "Mom sells the house and we all split the money" I am sure sounded great at the time, but was probably not in mom's best interest. No one is entitled to an inheritance of any kind, and to grab it while the person is still living seems like a risk. Of course, mom felt secure enough at the time to go along with it because she felt she was going to be taken care of but now you are kind of wanting to flip the script on her and make her go out on her own.

Finances always seem to bring out the worst in people. I don't think its fair of you and your husband to talk about the taxes, home owners insurance, bills, etc as these are all things you as the home owners would be expected to pay. But she did add value to your home and your lives and I understand your motivation for wanting to minimize it all now. (The addition didn't add much value! She didn't help with the kids much! Plus...she's mean!)

I hope you and your husband can at least be fair with your mom in this.
 
I really not planned on getting into this great of detail on the intimate details of my family dynamics, but so many of you seem to think that my siblings and I are all a bunch of evil and no good. My mother has always had trouble with simple tasks like I said in my previous posts. Be it setting an alarm clock, changing a light bulb, stupid mundane tasks that I can't even think of right now. My father took care of it all. He also did the grocery shopping and drove her to work everyday. This wasn't something that anyone ever approached her about, but we knew that for whatever reason-she had trouble with these kinds of things. I don't know if there is a term for it or a diagnosis-but again, it just is. When I mention my mother being a manipulator-this isn't meant to classify her as evil. This is a defense mechanism as well. If she doesn't know how to do a simple task-she doesn't tell you she doesn't know how to do it. She has mastered a way to work around it so you don't catch on that she doesn't know how to do something. If you're not around her enough-you probably wouldn't even know that you were being manipulated. One of her workarounds when it comes to setting her alarm clock if she has an early appointment is to ask you to check on her if you don't hear her up in the morning. Just silly little things like that. If you push the issue and say why don't you set your alarm clock? She will immediately get defensive and raise her voice, etc. so that you will just do as she asked.

When my father died-we we're all in a panic. They didn't have senior communities 19 years ago like they do now. Besides-she wasn't a senior. She knew she couldn't live on her own even though she didn't come right out and say it-and we knew it as well. She couldn't set her clock to get up in the morning, she couldn't drive her self to work, etc. When I mentioned the possibility of her moving in with me-she jumped on it and never considered any other options. For a time, it looked like it might not happen due to zoning laws and such. She was even more panicked. I realize this is not normal for most 54 year-olds and certainly not for myself. Nobody was thinking clearly and certainly nobody was looking to swindle my mother out of anything. We were young, in mourning and panicked. This seemed like the best idea at the time. Obviously it was not. When I say she thought it was permanent-that's because nobody discussed terms, alternate plans, etc. What if my husband and I got divorced? What if one of us passed away? What if job situations changed, etc. Nothing was discussed. She was just thrilled to have her immediate problem solved. When I say I thought it was permanent-I meant that I thought this was our forever home. Just like when people get married-they assume it's forever-sometimes it's not.

The situation was not good from the start. As I also mentioned previously. But, I couldn't afford to buy her out and I wasn't going to put her out. So we dealt with it. I wonder at times if she even thinks she should have done something different but felt the same way I did-that everything was already done. I never moved her in to be a babysitter-she worked herself. I'm not looking to bash her and say she never did a thing for me-but she was not my house cleaner, baby sitter, cook or whatever.

Once she retired, she started to winter in the South. She was still left with a nice nest egg and she used her savings to do this. She does not have enough income coming in to replenish the savings. She has been doing this for about 13 years now. I do not know what she has left.

When she winters in the south, she stays in a retirement community. She loves it and looks forward to this time every year. She participates in activities, hangs out at the pool, has a card night, etc. She cannot afford to live there year-round. I thought that she would be happier in something like that here, but would never initiate the move on her own due to financial concerns.

So going forward-I have three choices: We can all continue to live here with the changes to the neighborhood; I can move and bring her with me to a home that is secluded, harder for her to get out and about from and doesn't provide the amount of living space that she has now; or I can move and she can move into the retirement community

She will not be abandoned and dropped off like trash at the retirement community. Really people, I've said multiple times that I will help her and see to it that all of her needs are met. She is and will always be a part of my family-but I don't think that means she has to physically live with me.





"STUPID MUNDANE" TASKS summed it all up for ME! It's a shame, poor woman.
 

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