Travel Advisory - Canadian’s out of country

[Madame]

Not to freak anyone out, but I like to have an idea of what’s going to happen. This is what the exponential growth of this virus looks like:

 

[Where's Wall-E]

It really did seem like the border was closed for much longer than 48 hours!

While I see the reference to how fast it spread in Italy, we have to keep in mind that Europe is far more densely populated than most of Canada. Hopefully this, along with other measures, can help curb the extreme spreading of the virus.

 

[damo]

Meanwhile my MIL is trying to tell me that "No, it's not mandatory to self-isolate for 14 days if you've been out of the country." Um.... yeah, okay.

Where is she going home to?

 

[StarSeven7]

We're definitely in social isolation right now, we haven't left our house much for the past few days. My concern with all of this though is what happens when we go back to our normal routines - because obviously this can't go on forever. Will the number of cases spike up hugely then? So are we just delaying it? I know the idea is to "flatten the curve" which makes sense, but if everyone comes out of isolation at once, it seems like it won't be spreading gradually then - like they want - but really quickly? Maybe I'm missing something here...

 

[damo]

We're definitely in social isolation right now, we haven't left our house much for the past few days. My concern with all of this though is what happens when we go back to our normal routines - because obviously this can't go on forever. Will the number of cases spike up hugely then? So are we just delaying it? I know the idea is to "flatten the curve" which makes sense, but if everyone comes out of isolation at once, it seems like it won't be spreading gradually then - like they want - but really quickly? Maybe I'm missing something here...

It will keep spreading while we are social distancing, just more slowly. There are still lots of people out and about out of necessity. Gradually enough people will develop an immunity to it and it will slow down. We just don't want to overwhelm the health systems.

 

[Jrb1979]

We're definitely in social isolation right now, we haven't left our house much for the past few days. My concern with all of this though is what happens when we go back to our normal routines - because obviously this can't go on forever. Will the number of cases spike up hugely then? So are we just delaying it? I know the idea is to "flatten the curve" which makes sense, but if everyone comes out of isolation at once, it seems like it won't be spreading gradually then - like they want - but really quickly? Maybe I'm missing something here...

I think they are hoping that when the warmer weather comes it will help slow it down even more.

 

[Madame]

We're definitely in social isolation right now, we haven't left our house much for the past few days. My concern with all of this though is what happens when we go back to our normal routines - because obviously this can't go on forever. Will the number of cases spike up hugely then? So are we just delaying it? I know the idea is to "flatten the curve" which makes sense, but if everyone comes out of isolation at once, it seems like it won't be spreading gradually then - like they want - but really quickly? Maybe I'm missing something here...

Most will only have mild symptoms. It’s the 10-15% that will require care/hospitalization /ventilation that they are trying to spread out.

 

[Jrb1979]

All these measures they are doing is great but the biggest problem right now is the amount of people in Canada that still want to believe this is nothing and aren't doing the social distancing thing.

 

[StarSeven7]

Most will only have mild symptoms. It’s the 10-15% that will require care/hospitalization /ventilation that they are trying to spread out.

Right, I get that. But if the spread goes way down now when everyone's in isolation, it just seems like it will spike back up once everyone's out and about again.

 

[Madame]

Right, I get that. But if the spread goes way down now when everyone's in isolation, it just seems like it will spike back up once everyone's out and about again.

I think they’re counting on enough of the vulnerable getting it during that period (& even those not in the vulnerable category getting it while in « isolation ») that we start building up herd immunity. At this point containment is not an option. They just want those who are going to get it to be as spread out in terms of time as possible.

ETA @damo said it better I think.

 

[isabellea]

Right now governments are trying to slow dow transmission (flattening the curve), not stopping transmission. Experts predict 50-70% of the population will get it by the end of the year. It's how fast we get it that is important and why every Canadian need to be responsible and take this very seriously.

Going to work this morning was surreal. All the hospital entrances had security guards preventing visitors from entering and asking questions. Only children can be accompanied by an adult and only by 1 parent, not both. I also had to show my ID card to prove I was an employee. Our labs are in a separate building from the main hospital and we have very little contact with patients but we were asked to only go in for experiments we cannot postpone and to try to work from home as much as possible so I might only go back Friday if it's still allowed. My boss who I work closely with (Principal Investigator) is also a MD working at the ICU. He will be on service 3 of the next 4 weeks so I'm basically on my own and I will probably worry for him and our colleagues (our research program is mainly composed of the critical care team that also do research) since there's unfortunately a doctor who got COVID-19 in the resp department and it's probably only the beginning.

 

[StarSeven7]

I think they’re counting on enough of the vulnerable getting it during that period (& even those not in the vulnerable category getting it while in « isolation ») that we start building up herd immunity. At this point containment is not an option. They just want those who are going to get it to be as spread out in terms of time as possible.

ETA @damo said it better I think.

Thanks! That makes sense. Hopefully the health care system doesn't get overwhelmed at any point!

 

[mshanson3121]

Where is she going home to?

Nowhere. We were just discussing the ongoing issues and she said there's no order to self-isolate if you're traveling

 

[mshanson3121]

Going back to anxiety...

It's not just adults that are struggling, but children. Our DD has Autism, and has had a bad day - a lot of behaviors. She finally broke down tonight, and it was all Covid related. It's a cumulative effect for her - the change in daily routine, the shut down of her activities (dance, Girl Guides etc...), her father coming home, us being more stringent on hand washing etc... and of course what she hears incidentally, even though we try to keep most of it from them, but some discussion has had to take place that she's heard, and now she's carrying the weight of the world on her little shoulders.

 

[Madame]

Going back to anxiety...

It's not just adults that are struggling, but children. Our DD has Autism, and has had a bad day - a lot of behaviors. She finally broke down tonight, and it was all Covid related. It's a cumulative effect for her - the change in daily routine, the shut down of her activities (dance, Girl Guides etc...), her father coming home, us being more stringent on hand washing etc... and of course what she hears incidentally, even though we try to keep most of it from them, but some discussion has had to take place that she's heard, and now she's carrying the weight of the world on her little shoulders.

So sorry for your girl. I know mine too are more subdued than normal (seeking to be close/reassurance) and it’s hard to reassure them when everything is so upside down and they thrive on routine. I had a talk to myself all alone in the bathroom today lol. It went something like « you’re the Mom & cannot lose your $&@! right now ». The sooner this is over the better for all of us. Hugs to you

 

[quandrea]

My son is worried we are going to lose our house. He heard talk of that on tv. I assured him we will be okay.

 

[Madame]

I don’t know if any of you have teens, but this is a good read if you do

https://grownandflown.com/italy-cov...jYtKBlzOZcWOgnMhIDiwyI9wSBvIaT3JwcTMo_ZcJ4cVQ

 

[ottawamom]

My son is worried we are going to lose our house. He heard talk of that on tv. I assured him we will be okay.

We've been having that discussion around here since 2001. DH works in high tech. He was laid off back then, since then there has been cyclical layoffs in his industry. I've assured the boys over the years that because we have lived with this constant threat we have always been prepared to weather the storm. I let them know we have an emergency fund that will cover our expenses for X period of time. Nothing major will change in the way they live their lives.

Be honest with them. This is a great opportunity to teach a little household finance and the necessity of an emergency fund etc (assuming your child is old enough to understand).

With the fluctuations in the stock market the last few weeks I've been discussing with my DS who is at home the ups and downs I have experienced and how we need to react to it (or not). I hope, he will learn through my experience when he invests his money in the years to come.

Bottom line, we can model positive reactions to everything that is going on around us today. We can also let them know that we are upset/anxious/mad/ concerned and let them know that is also a normal reaction. Our kids watch us more closely than we are always willing to acknowledge. We and they will grow stronger as a result.

 

[Starwind]

I'm sorry, but they should shut it down to Americans, too. They pose just as much risk. And, honestly for the US, vice versa.

You can easily allow transports through, without allowing general tourists etc...

My guess based on listening to the press conferences yesterday is:

They were clear in reminding that when you enter Canada from outside Canada you are subject to a 14 day self-isolation period. Comment: This applies to any US tourists and should seriously cut down on any tourists who would want to come as it would serious scupper their plans. They do have exceptions for essential workers (e.g truck drivers, airline crews) who can't be self-isolating every time they cross the border, but that is not the "letting in Americans" concern here.

They are very clear about Canadians get home NOW. Part of this is because it is getting harder and harder to do on commercial transportation. Part of it...

I will not be surprised if, and this is a GUESS, **in coorrdination with the US government**, at some point in the near future the Canada-US border both ways is closed to everyone except defined essential services. And the definition of essential services will be the same for both countries -- it will be a coordinated approach between the two countries. This will take a bit of time to work out, and is likely why the border is open as it is for now. [*it would also presumably remain open to citizens/PR *returning home* at least for a while since citizens have a right to enter the country per the constitution [but that could be curtailed in these extraordinary times]].

ETA: they were also clear in stating that both the US and Canada have said people should avoid all non-essential travel, again cluing people in that they should not be traveling for tourist reasons, only essential reasons.

 

[mshanson3121]

My guess based on listening to the press conferences yesterday is:

They were clear in reminding that when you enter Canada from outside Canada you are subject to a 14 day self-isolation period. Comment: This applies to any US tourists and should seriously cut down on any tourists who would want to come as it would serious scupper their plans. They do have exceptions for essential workers (e.g truck drivers, airline crews) who can't be self-isolating every time they cross the border, but that is not the "letting in Americans" concern here.

They are very clear about Canadians get home NOW. Part of this is because it is getting harder and harder to do on commercial transportation. Part of it...

I will not be surprised if, and this is a GUESS, **in coorrdination with the US government**, at some point in the near future the Canada-US border both ways is closed to everyone except defined essential services. And the definition of essential services will be the same for both countries -- it will be a coordinated approach between the two countries. This will take a bit of time to work out, and is likely why the border is open as it is for now. [*it would also presumably remain open to citizens/PR *returning home* at least for a while since citizens have a right to enter the country per the constitution [but that could be curtailed in these extraordinary times]].

I agree. I wouldn't be surprised to see it closed within a week.