What is going on with Disney parks?

[dlavender]

Some of it is timing and understanding drops. Some of it is party size. MK doesnt have the drops the other parks do, but, it also doesnt have tiers.
I just went on and for 4 people in 3 refreshes saw BTMRR, Space, Pan. Took about 10 refreshes before stumbling onto a 7DMT. Epcot Soarin and FEA both came up within 5 refreshes. Studios RNRC, TSM, ToT all popped immediately. SDD took a few minutes but one did come up. Which is a surprise since its just past a drop time. Everything at AK came up immediately other than FoP but that drop time is upcoming so itll pop in a bit.

We are normally 2 or 3 but I added another friend with an AP to get me to 4 and everything seemed normal to me.

Again, we go a lot so the refresh is a second nature kind of thing and Im not even as adept at it as my wife is. But we generally just do it if we are in a FP line or want to do something in particular. What I have noticed is the people who consistently post about getting what they want when they want are generally resident APs who understand drops and how to refresh. And do it regularly. Again, new test in two weeks will be using 21+ FPs in one day and see what happens and what we pull.Not something we do all the time, but after doing the 4 park challenge and taking it even further ( which we wont do again EVER), a one day how many FPs can you pull will be interesting. We do tours and just casually enjoy the parks most days, but, now and then trying something challenging is fun.

This is a great example of my lack of luck.

I just tried for 5 mins looking for a party of 3 and did see PP, BTMR. No SM or 7DMT. And in my case, it doesn't help as even as I snagged that PP, I still now need to find one for a party of 2 with an overlapping time.

 

[YesterDark]

Then consider yourself lucky b/c on multiple threads other ppl have reported having similar issues.

You don't get lucky haven't no issued over 3-4 weeks of vacation over multiple years. And of course you'll never have a day without some kind of issue somewhere with 10 upon 10's of thousands of people all over the place.

 

[disneyseniors]

I think this is most likely true. I enjoy Disney but they don't get a lot of money from my family even though we go once, maybe twice a year. We have food delivered to the resorts so we don't eat as many meals in the parks and resorts. We don't do extras, no desert parties or special experiences. We rarely buy souveniers. Heck our next trip we rented points because we wanted to stay in a deluxe resort and not pay resort prices. We do eat one to two meals a day in the parks but usually just counter service. Our only real splurge is park hoppers, we find it our best bang for our buck. So I know we really aren't their target consumer because we just don't consume enough and that's okay. I enjoy Disney even without all the extras and I don't begrudge anyone who does the extras. We've done character meals and parties and realized they aren't for us.

That sounds pretty much like what we do We don't order food in, because I cook all year and I don't want to cook on my vacation - just a personal preference. Just like my husband doesn't like to drive in the Florida traffic (who does, LOL), so we use magical express and the parks transportation system. We have quit buying souveniers for others. However, I get an ornament each trip and I love the HM merch. We eat QS for most meals, but have a couple of TS that we do OOP. No extra parties or events for us either. No DP either. We find that paying OOP works for us. We are less full and actually eat when and where we want. Like you, we don't begrudge anyone else for doing the extras. That's just the way we do Disney

 

[ChipnDale79]

I apologize. Didnt mean to offend.

The disconnect is that Disney is not the same company it was and peoples nostalgia drives a wedge. Disney has to move forward and accommodate a new and growing user base. They are adapting to changing demographics. You and 1000’s of others will walk away and it will make no difference and this is prob what will bother former customers the most.

thanks for the apology, not needed, but thank you anyways.

And you're right, it does bother me. I've spent thousands and thousands of dollars at WDW and on disney related items, and at some point i just have to say "enough is enough", they only get so much of my money.

 

[5kidsmommy]

That sounds pretty much like what we do We don't order food in, because I cook all year and I don't want to cook on my vacation - just a personal preference. Just like my husband doesn't like to drive in the Florida traffic (who does, LOL), so we use magical express and the parks transportation system. We have quit buying souveniers for others. However, I get an ornament each trip and I love the HM merch. We eat QS for most meals, but have a couple of TS that we do OOP. No extra parties or events for us either. No DP either. We find that paying OOP works for us. We are less full and actually eat when and where we want. Like you, we don't begrudge anyone else for doing the extras. That's just the way we do Disney

I should say I do not cook on vacation. We just mostly do breakfast in the room and sandwiches. It's why I don't see the need to rent a one bedroom villa or larger. We just aren't big breakfast eaters and I cannot justify the cost of breakfast. We just did a quick trip last week and we ate all meals at the parks and hotel and even got adults drinks. It was an odd trip for us but kind of nice to splurge.

 

[Brianstl]

It is really crazy what Disney has been able to do at their domestic parks and resorts over the last five years. The actual amount of people going to the parks hasn't really increased much if it all (I think the number of people in the park per ticketed day has probably gone down if you would properly factor in all the added ticketed events), but how much Disney has been able to increase the amount those people spend is absolutely crazy. Per capita spending per park guest has increased 30%. They have reduced the total room nights at the resorts by more than 600,000. So while the occupancy rate of resort rooms has gone up, the total number of rooms filled per year has gone down slightly. That doesn't matter because per room guest spending has gone from $295 to $353 per night.

Disney has been able to double the operating income of the division since 2015 while actually booking less hotel rooms and probably having less individual people visiting the parks.

 

[Mome Rath]

I don't think there is a disconnect at this point. Why? Data and more data. Statistics are their bread and butter along with survey results. One of the longest surveys I filled out for them lately was all about pricing, and recommendations to others. They are constantly collecting data and sifting through it. They are responding to the data.... as a huge company they have to rely on stats, not anecdotes. All we have are anecdotes, multiple anecdotes (on each "side" of every issue we talk about), but not the actual data that they have.

 

[clarker99]

thanks for the apology, not needed, but thank you anyways.

And you're right, it does bother me. I've spent thousands and thousands of dollars at WDW and on disney related items, and at some point i just have to say "enough is enough", they only get so much of my money.

I totally get that. There are opportunity costs for that money you spent.

This is completely anecdotal but when I try and plan a family holiday to almost anywhere (Mexico, New York, San Fran, Hawaii, Europe, Palm Springs, Anaheim etc). By the time you do all the things you want to do like rent a car, accommodations, eat/drink, buy merchandise and do the tourist type things, I am in the same wheelhouse (if not more) than WDW. Travel is expensive. And with a young family, WDW just ticks all the boxes for us at this point in our lives.

 

[Heather07438]

So... how 'bout them price increases lol? This board will never stay buried for long

I think it increased our next trip by around $150. In the grand scheme of WDW budgets it's not a huge difference. After the other rapid increases we already decided to forgo our yearly trip in 2020, instead we'll add several days on to our early 2021 trip which greatly reduces cost/day (& removes 1 set of RT airfares).

It's probably all the same to WDW. While they'll take a hit from us buying 9-day tickets for much less than our two 5-day tickets, they'll make most of that up with our increased food & resort costs. One negative to them is our long term reduction of visits. We generally go once a year and some years visited 2-4 times. That's much less likely now.

 

[Remy is Up]

I don't think there is a disconnect at this point. Why? Data and more data. Statistics are their bread and butter along with survey results. One of the longest surveys I filled out for them lately was all about pricing, and recommendations to others. They are constantly collecting data and sifting through it. They are responding to the data.... as a huge company they have to rely on stats, not anecdotes. All we have are anecdotes, multiple anecdotes (on each "side" of every issue we talk about), but not the actual data that they have.

I did that Survey as well. We end up doing a fair amount of them since we are there so much, but, Disney is VERY diligent and methodical about their data mining and analysis. They are ahead of the curve 90% of the time which is what makes them so successful. And this goes from pricing a 3$ toy in the emporium to what to charge for a room on any given night in any resort to ticket pricing. Everything they do is detailed and has layers. My daughter went through the application process for a job and they were told after she got the position that they had 4000 applicants and used the 4 tier interview system to whittle it down from 4K to just under 500 to just under 250 to interviewing only 75 of the 4K who applied. And of those they hired just 16. And having a few other friends who work there in various departments from ecommerce to Guest relations management to operations management, I have heard the stories about how detailed they are and how they stick to the script and rules and use data gathered data to create them. This isnt a company that just wishes or pretends it understands data and analytics. It writes the book.

 

[SoarinSC]

This is my main concern for my next trip. For us it’s the combination of Disney changes that make the parks so much more crowded & we now have a toddler. We were able to do things in the past to mitigate crowds when it was just DH & I, but WDW is not little-kid friendly. We know it’ll be crowded & think we have a good strategy for our upcoming trip. But, if it doesn’t go well, we will be done for a while. It used to be it was only ppl on this board who I saw saying they’re done, but now I know several families irl who have quit going b/c the magic just isn’t there anymore. I’m really hoping that doesn’t happen to us.

I hope not either! Hope all goes well

 

[SoarinSC]

Keep thinking about this point and I think there's something to it. The crowds/prices/construction is another story entirely, but as someone who has been a chronic planner in the past, I've been working on doing less and going with the flow and it's probably better for my mental health.

Totally echo this. Less planning, more flow has helped a lot. But I understand that its not so easy for others, I've been to the parks enough and have gotten to an age, where throttling down isn't too hard an adjustement. Again, I totally get where people can be frustrated with the whole experience as it is right now.

 

[YesterDark]

If you're planning a Disney Vacation book as early and fast as possible. Make sure you always have that down payment in your back pocket to plop down if you find an interesting date to go 1.5 years in advance.

Cancel early, cancel often.

 

[mshanson3121]

Let me amend that to say, most ticket prices and hoppers were increased overnight. I expect food increases across the board shortly.

Character dining prices were raised a week or so ago I believe.

 

[rteetz]

Character dining prices were raised a week or so ago I believe.

A few weeks ago now. It wasn't all character dining either.

 

[mshanson3121]

the only way to stop it is by people not going, going less frequent.

too many people toss money at disney like its candy, its like a drug to some people.

This. We have been planning a trip for 2021. Planned a full week on site, buying 4 day tickets, but when I crunched the numbers, I was shocked. After the price increase, a 4 day base ticket pass for a family of 4 in June (all 10+) is $1908!!! That is just beyond ridiculous. (And that's US$. Convert that to Canadian and that's $2600). And I refuse to spend it. We are going away to New Hampshire for 8 nights this summer. We've rented a very nice townhouse, we're planning 4-5 days of paid activities, including 2.5 days at local theme parks. The total cost for our entire trip (Lodging, attractions, gas to get there and groceries) is $2000 $US vs. $1900 just for tickets at Disney.

Anyways, we have a set of free comp tickets and the kids have been promised a trip, so we're going. But I told my husband it will no longer be a long trip. We'll do 3 nights on site, we'll do one park day with our free comp tickets, and have a resort day, and MAYBE do one extra like a character meal or NBA. But that's it.

There are other places to go, even other Disney places to go, especially Disney parks.

We can do DL quite a bit cheaper than DW. I would definitely be open to trying them someday. But otherwise, after our next trip I really don't see us going back. As you said - way too many other places to see, that are far more affordable.

Not intended to be political but I live outside the US and I have encountered many over the last 3 years that simply won’t go to Disney/USA during this administration. Simple fact. Not arguing the point one way or another.

I agree. I know many who refuse to step foot in the US until things calm down and things change.

Exactly & a lot of us are saying that we don’t really assess value in how many rides we do but the overall “magic”. But, there is very little magic in trying to refresh for 45 min straight, in wall-to-wall ppl with an impatient toddler hanging off you.

It's the "magic" that has kept Disney on our minds. Ride for ride, we have more fun elsewhere. Less crowds, less planning, easier to get around, just more enjoyable. BUT, it's the parades, the shows, the fireworks, seeing characters from your favorite movies etc... You just don't get that anywhere else. That is what makes Disney special in our eyes. And the more they keep cutting back on that....

This is completely anecdotal but when I try and plan a family holiday to almost anywhere (Mexico, New York, San Fran, Hawaii, Europe, Palm Springs, Anaheim etc). By the time you do all the things you want to do like rent a car, accommodations, eat/drink, buy merchandise and do the tourist type things, I am in the same wheelhouse (if not more) than WDW. Travel is expensive. And with a young family, WDW just ticks all the boxes for us at this point in our lives.

It must depend on the type of trip you plan, because we can do most of those for cheaper than we can do a week at a value resort at Disney. The only exception would be Europe.

 

[Remy is Up]

Whether or not a person or family chooses to go to Disney or not is an individual choice. There is no right or wrong answer across the board. If you find it to have less value than other trips, then by all means, do whats best for you. We go to the Keys or the Islands once or twice yearly, every couple of years an international ( Euro or Asian) trip, and still go to other parks and such. And luckily due to locality, go to WDW a great deal. For us it has value whether day trips or long staycation weekends and being a resident and close by makes that easier. I measure all of those other trips the way someone not from here would measure WDW, so I certainly understand the commentary.

 

[Itsnotmykitchen]

Not intended to be political but I live outside the US and I have encountered many over the last 3 years that simply won’t go to Disney/USA during this administration. Simple fact. Not arguing the point one way or another.

International travel declined in 2016 but has been back up since. I can't imagine Trump had that huge of an effect in 2016 since he wasn't technically in office. I would think the stronger US dollar is having more of an impact but again international travel hasn't actually declined for the US.

 

[clarker99]

It must depend on the type of trip you plan, because we can do most of those for cheaper than we can do a week at a value resort at Disney. The only exception would be Europe.

Like I said, it is my experience in booking things. We have to fly from the middle of nowhere Canada, which adds extra costs. Plus the terrible exchange rate. I will admit that we don't do things as cheap as possible but I don't find anywhere that much cheaper than WDW after all is said done. For example the main difference bw WDW or DLR and other types of holidays are the park tickets costs which we usually end up spending the difference on a rental car, upgraded hotel (air bnb, B&B etc), wine tour or pro sports game, etc. It all adds up. I do appreciate that you could do any of these things 'cheaper' but alas we do not.

 

[mshanson3121]

Like I said, it is my experience in booking things. We have to fly from the middle of nowhere Canada, which adds extra costs. Plus the terrible exchange rate. I will admit that we don't do things as cheap as possible but I don't find anywhere that much cheaper than WDW after all is said done. For example the main difference bw WDW or DLR and other types of holidays are the park tickets costs which we usually end up spending the difference on a rental car, upgraded hotel (air bnb, B&B etc), wine tour or pro sports game, etc. It all adds up. I do appreciate that you could do any of these things 'cheaper' but alas we do not.

For reference, we are also from Canada. However, we are only 5-7 hours from several US airports, so that does save on flying.