Another Shooting, Nashville

[JaneBanks]

Not surprisingly, DIS members turn a thread about a tragic event into a thread about themselves. It's really annoying and it makes you all look bad, no matter what side you're taking. Either take it to PM, make another thread or just take a hold of your mature side and just stop posting. Show some respect for the murdered and their families. Give those of us who care about the actual tragedy a break and let us mourn without this stupid back and forth.

 

[robinb]

Not surprisingly, DIS members turn a thread about a tragic event into a thread about themselves. It's really annoying and it makes you all look bad, no matter what side you're taking. Either take it to PM, make another thread or just take a hold of your mature side and just stop posting. Show some respect for the murdered and their families. Give those of us who care about the actual tragedy a break and let us mourn without this stupid back and forth.

I stopped "engaging" 9 pages back for that very reason.

 

[UncleMike101]

Not surprisingly, DIS members turn a thread about a tragic event into a thread about themselves. It's really annoying and it makes you all look bad, no matter what side you're taking. Either take it to PM, make another thread or just take a hold of your mature side and just stop posting. Show some respect for the murdered and their families. Give those of us who care about the actual tragedy a break and let us mourn without this stupid back and forth.

If I don't like, or approve, of a particular topic of discussion then I'll have the good grace to stay out of it.
If you are not happy with this discussion you are free to ignore it and proceed with your life.
It's much like owning a particular type of firearm.
If you don't like them, don't own them.
But don't presume to tell others that they shouldn't own them.

 

[longboard55]

wow this is still going.

For the record, there is absolutly no movement in congress to ban all guns and there never has been. That is a 100% FAKE argument. Its a huge lie.

The current bills they can not pass that have 90% public support are the Bumpstock ban and banning known terrorists from buying guns.

 

[JaneBanks]

If I don't like, or approve, of a particular topic of discussion then I'll have the good grace to stay out of it.
If you are not happy with this discussion you are free to ignore it and proceed with your life.
It's much like owning a particular type of firearm.
If you don't like them, don't own them.
But don't presume to tell others that they shouldn't own them.

Maybe if this thread was intended for a gun debate, then yes, I would stay out of it but it was not. It was meant to be about the recent shooting. I would LOVE to ignore it but I have to come back here and scroll through endless debate to find the one or two posts that are actually about the shooting. Other's have totally taken the thread off topic and it's very annoying to read the annoying back and forth that will go absolutely nowhere. If you want a gun debate thread, make one but this isn't it.

I love the irony of the bolded.

 

[Bianca and Bernard]

Yes my point they own MANY MANY guns. And I bet they all drive trucks with the American flag or Confederate flag on it lol. I'm teasing. I know many gun owners and hunters and have them in my own family. Like I said my father was a shooting instructor also. Unfortunately many do not realize they've been brainwashed and controlled by misinformation etc., by special interests. It's pervasive here in the US. It's everywhere.
What can you say to this Nothing at all!
The Second Amendment Does Not Protect Your Right to own these type weapons it is decided by the Supreme Court.
https://www.msnbc.com/the-beat-with-ari melber/watch/no-there-s-no-2nd-amendment-right-to-ar-15s-1171097667761

Well, shoot, if we're going to use opinion pieces, let's go for it.

https://newrepublic.com/article/125498/its-time-ban-guns-yes-them

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/ban-guns-in-america
(At least 183 people agree with the ban the guns idea)

https://www.facebook.com/Bangunsintheus
(107 likes there)

http://www.vpc.org/studies/unsafe.htm

There are people calling for gun bans. There are even posters here who call for full on gun bans, in past gun threads. So, yes, on the EXTREME end of one side, there are people calling for gun bans.

 

[Hikergirl]

wow this is still going.

For the record, there is absolutly no movement in congress to ban all guns and there never has been. That is a 100% FAKE argument. Its a huge lie.

The current bills they can not pass that have 90% public support are the Bumpstock ban and banning known terrorists from buying guns.

Who here has said there was?

 

[Bianca and Bernard]

wow this is still going.

For the record, there is absolutly no movement in congress to ban all guns and there never has been. That is a 100% FAKE argument. Its a huge lie.

The current bills they can not pass that have 90% public support are the Bumpstock ban and banning known terrorists from buying guns.

I don't think anyone said, including myself, that there was a movement in congress to ban all guns. I stated there are people on each end of the extreme who want to ban all weapons or have looser/nonexistant gun laws.

Just for the record, IMO, there needs to be some strengthening of gun laws, and some penalties if you fail to follow those laws. Including:
Age for purchase: 21 for rifles/shotguns; 25 for handguns. Exception: military/police personnel.
Required for purchase: Gun safety and gun use classes.
Required for purchase: One week mandatory waiting period. Background check, including through military, mental health and criminal systems that need to be set up specifically for this use.
Required for purchase: Only through registered firearm dealers. No more gun show sales. Want to buy Uncle Bob's pistol? He takes it to the dealer, the dealer does the required checks, one week later you can buy the pistol from the dealer.
After purchase: Firearms must be kept in a locked, secured location. Gun safe or gun case is allowable. Trigger locks must be in place when not using the firearm. Ammo must be kept in a secondary locked, secured location.
After purchase: Failure to keep weapons secured results in penalties, up to and including being charge as an accomplice in any crime that occurs with your personal weapon. You leave your weapon unsecured, under the couch, and your 5 year old gets it and shoots mom in the back? You go to jail and lose your gun owning privileges. You leave your weapon in your car, unsecured, and a guy breaks into the car and steals the weapon? You go to jail and lose your gun owning privileges.

 

[longboard55]

I don't think anyone said, including myself, that there was a movement in congress to ban all guns. I stated there are people on each end of the extreme who want to ban all weapons or have looser/nonexistant gun laws.

Just for the record, IMO, there needs to be some strengthening of gun laws, and some penalties if you fail to follow those laws. Including:
Age for purchase: 21 for rifles/shotguns; 25 for handguns. Exception: military/police personnel.
Required for purchase: Gun safety and gun use classes.
Required for purchase: One week mandatory waiting period. Background check, including through military, mental health and criminal systems that need to be set up specifically for this use.
Required for purchase: Only through registered firearm dealers. No more gun show sales. Want to buy Uncle Bob's pistol? He takes it to the dealer, the dealer does the required checks, one week later you can buy the pistol from the dealer.
After purchase: Firearms must be kept in a locked, secured location. Gun safe or gun case is allowable. Trigger locks must be in place when not using the firearm. Ammo must be kept in a secondary locked, secured location.
After purchase: Failure to keep weapons secured results in penalties, up to and including being charge as an accomplice in any crime that occurs with your personal weapon. You leave your weapon unsecured, under the couch, and your 5 year old gets it and shoots mom in the back? You go to jail and lose your gun owning privileges. You leave your weapon in your car, unsecured, and a guy breaks into the car and steals the weapon? You go to jail and lose your gun owning privileges.

Those ideas would have very wide support, so why do we not do it, that is what is frustrating people. No law will make everything perfect, by my goodness we can at least try to make things safer, we do not even try.

 

[UncleMike101]

Who here has said there was?

There you go again.
Trying to bring facts into the discussion.
Have you no shame?

 

[Hikergirl]

Those ideas would have very wide support, so why do we not do it, that is what is frustrating people. No law will make everything perfect, by my goodness we can at least try to make things safer, we do not even try.

I personally don't agree with the 21/25 age restriction. I think that would be the biggest obstacle for a Federal law, the other suggestions are more than reasonable, and there are States where they are already in effect (some of them anyway).

 

[Bianca and Bernard]

Those ideas would have very wide support, so why do we not do it, that is what is frustrating people. No law will make everything perfect, by my goodness we can at least try to make things safer, we do not even try.

I truly think it's because of the people on those extreme ends. One side pushes, the other pushes back, and no one wins. We get a bill that says the age limits for purchases, and some guy on one side will add a rider to ban magazines with more than 5 onto it, or on the other side will add a rider for unbanning full on assault rifles. Then nothing gets passed because both of those things are over the top.

One day, DH and I were at the local shooting range. I had to take a class on their rules at the range, as it was my first time there (DH had been there before and had completed it already). The range was running a concealed weapon class that day, and some of the people there should not have had a gun in their hands. One woman had the gun in hand while in line for the class, chatting with her friends (and honey, they were all WASPs if I've ever seen one). She waved that gun around while talking. The sheriff that was there to process the applications for the class walked over to her, removed the gun from her hand and told her she wouldn't be taking the class that day; and that if she wanted that gun back, she needed to talk to the nice deputies at the station house and explain to them why he took her gun away. She had never held a gun before, she said, so she didn't know the rules on it. The sheriff said that is why she didn't need to have the gun or a CC permit that day. The tantrum she threw rivaled those over-tired 2 year olds at WDW. She ended up with cuffs on, for disturbing the peace, and the sheriff shut down the CC class for the day. I just wanted to smack her, but went on to my class, and learned that while I am right handed, I am a left handed shooter.

I don't know why I added that story, but I like it, so it's staying.

 

[Bianca and Bernard]

I personally don't agree with the 21/25 age restriction. I think that would be the biggest obstacle for a Federal law, the other suggestions are more than reasonable, and there are States where they are already in effect.

I think we need these on the Federal level, TBH. Hard to regulate guns in Illinois if you aren't regulating them the same in Missouri, Indiana or Iowa.

 

[longboard55]

I truly think it's because of the people on those extreme ends. One side pushes, the other pushes back, and no one wins. We get a bill that says the age limits for purchases, and some guy on one side will add a rider to ban magazines with more than 5 onto it, or on the other side will add a rider for unbanning full on assault rifles. Then nothing gets passed because both of those things are over the top.

One day, DH and I were at the local shooting range. I had to take a class on their rules at the range, as it was my first time there (DH had been there before and had completed it already). The range was running a concealed weapon class that day, and some of the people there should not have had a gun in their hands. One woman had the gun in hand while in line for the class, chatting with her friends (and honey, they were all WASPs if I've ever seen one). She waved that gun around while talking. The sheriff that was there to process the applications for the class walked over to her, removed the gun from her hand and told her she wouldn't be taking the class that day; and that if she wanted that gun back, she needed to talk to the nice deputies at the station house and explain to them why he took her gun away. She had never held a gun before, she said, so she didn't know the rules on it. The sheriff said that is why she didn't need to have the gun or a CC permit that day. The tantrum she threw rivaled those over-tired 2 year olds at WDW. She ended up with cuffs on, for disturbing the peace, and the sheriff shut down the CC class for the day. I just wanted to smack her, but went on to my class, and learned I am right handed, but am a left handed shooter. Interesting.

I would think gun owners would insist on safety training. They are the ones that will get shot by accident. I was backwoods shooting once, and a car pulls up and they were treating rifles like golf clubs, we left asap

 

[Hikergirl]

I think we need these on the Federal level, TBH. Hard to regulate guns in Illinois if you aren't regulating them the same in Missouri, Indiana or Iowa.

I agree, there should be common sense laws that apply equally to all citizens.
Truth is not all requirements are statewide either. When my dh got his CCL he wasn't required to take any safety training. I didn't think much of it, he had grown up with guns and has a very healthy respect for them and he is a stickler for safety. However I know that means that anyone in my county that has a CCL didn't have to take a safety training class, and who knows just how responsible they are.
FTR, he did have to take a class to join the local gun club, and he made my ds take it. He also made me, my dd and my younger ds watch the online portion with them (although we weren't taking the physical test at the range after).
I have relatives in 3 other counties (same State), 2 are required to take a training class to get their CCL. I won't allow the other relative to shoot near my kids unless dh is there with them all. Luckily he doesn't carry in public, he just target shoots in his yard, but still.

I will say I don't think safety classes will stop things like what happened at Waffle House, but I think that anyone who is going to handle a firearm learn some basic safety about them before being allowed out in public with them.

 

[UncleMike101]

I think we need these on the Federal level, TBH. Hard to regulate guns in Illinois if you aren't regulating them the same in Missouri, Indiana or Iowa.

That's where the Constitutional States Rights issues come up.
The Federal Government has no authority whatsoever to tell a State how to legislate internal issues.

I personally don't agree with the 21/25 age restriction. I think that would be the biggest obstacle for a Federal law, the other suggestions are more than reasonable, and there are States where they are already in effect (some of them anyway).

If we were to enforce a 21/25 restriction on exercising the Second Amendment's rights, then maybe we should also place the same restrictions on voting rights.
If one isn't mature enough to own firearms they are likely not mature enough to make decisions that can affect the future of our Republic.
As for other restrictions, I'm of the opinion that the thousands of firearms laws already on the books are more that sufficient to handle the problems.
The problem is that those laws are not enforced adequately.

 

[longboard55]

That's where the Constitutional States Rights issues come up.
The Federal Government has no authority whatsoever to tell a State how to legislate internal issues.

If we were to enforce a 21/25 restriction on exercising the Second Amendment's rights, then maybe we should also place the same restrictions on voting rights.
If one isn't mature enough to own firearms they are likely not mature enough to make decisions that can affect the future of our Republic.
As for other restrictions, I'm of the opinion that the thousands of firearms laws already on the books are more that sufficient to handle the problems.
The problem is that those laws are not enforced adequately.

change is on the horizon, and it's exactly this attitude that is rowing the boat. So do not complain when it happens

 

[luvsJack]

That's where the Constitutional States Rights issues come up.
The Federal Government has no authority whatsoever to tell a State how to legislate internal issues.

If we were to enforce a 21/25 restriction on exercising the Second Amendment's rights, then maybe we should also place the same restrictions on voting rights.
If one isn't mature enough to own firearms they are likely not mature enough to make decisions that can affect the future of our Republic.
As for other restrictions, I'm of the opinion that the thousands of firearms laws already on the books are more that sufficient to handle the problems.
The problem is that those laws are not enforced adequately.

I agree with the bolded. We need to fix the issues we have with the laws in places. If the laws are not going to be enforced adequately then we are only chasing our tails when adding more laws. Fix the problems and then see if more laws are necessary.

I don't agree with the 21/25 restriction. There are a lot of young women on their own prior to these ages. I think they should have the right to protect themselves.

 

[Hikergirl]

That's where the Constitutional States Rights issues come up.
The Federal Government has no authority whatsoever to tell a State how to legislate internal issues.

If we were to enforce a 21/25 restriction on exercising the Second Amendment's rights, then maybe we should also place the same restrictions on voting rights.
If one isn't mature enough to own firearms they are likely not mature enough to make decisions that can affect the future of our Republic.
As for other restrictions, I'm of the opinion that the thousands of firearms laws already on the books are more that sufficient to handle the problems.
The problem is that those laws are not enforced adequately.

I agree they are not enforced, and that is a big problem. I still believe that some across the board laws make sense, but ONLY if they are enforced. I think we need to do more to keep guns out of the hands of those who should not have them. Parkland and Waffle House being the most recent examples.
I do not think that we should make knee jerk decisions that do nothing but make law abiding gun owners criminals for the sake of saying "see we did something".

 

[UncleMike101]

change is on the horizon, and it's exactly this attitude that is rowing the boat. So do not complain when it happens

Change is always on the horizon.
What that change turns out to be will be determined by whom has the necessary fortitude to enforce the changes if they are just, or to resist if the changes are unjust.
If changes weren't made we in America would all be having tea and crumpets in the afternoon.




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