Alec Baldwin shoots/kills cinematographer and injured director after firing a "prop gun".

[Pea-n-Me]

There is a lot of detail here about how this went down.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ointed-gun-camera-weapon-fired-rehearsal.html

A few tidbits that were interesting:

Helyea Hutchins’ husband, Matt, is a lawyer.

Because rehearsal was delayed with many on the set walking off, they had to move the one camera they were using as the natural lighting had shifted. Unclear if camera was filming, or not, it reads both ways.

This type of gun had to have both the hammer pulled back, then the trigger pulled, so double action in order for it to fire. Most of these articles we’ve seen have not mentioned this, they talk as if the gun ”misfired” accidentally.

Directly from the article:

”Hollywood professionals say they're baffled by the circumstances and production crews have quickly stepped up safety measures.

Jeffrey Wright, who has worked on projects including the James Bond franchise and the upcoming movie 'The Batman,' was acting with a weapon on the set of 'Westworld' when news broke of the shooting Thursday at a New Mexico ranch. 'We were all pretty shocked. And it informed what we did from that moment on,' he said in an interview Sunday at the Newport Beach Film Festival.

'I don't recall ever being handed a weapon that was not cleared in front of me - meaning chamber open, barrel shown to me, light flashed inside the barrel to make sure that it's cleared,' Wright said. 'Clearly, that was a mismanaged set.'

Actor Ray Liotta agreed with Wright that the checks on firearms are usually extensive.

'They always - that I know of - they check it so you can see,' Liotta said. 'They give it to the person you're pointing the gun at, they do it to the producer, they show whoever is there that it doesn't work.'

 

[dominiondad]

If your job requires you to handle firearms, you should know how to do it safely.

No one should be immune from firearm safety, including actors, no one.

No exceptions, no excuses.

This! Some jobs require you to handle firearms - police, military, security, animal control, etc. This includes actors. If you have a job that requires firearms handling, it is your responsibility to do so safely. There is only one difference between this and a cop who, after being told a gun was unloaded, points it into a crowd, pulls the trigger, and kills somebody. The cop would be immediately suspended, be the subject of protests, and likely face charges. Baldwin had his assistants pack his bags for the Hamptons.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

More:

”Serge Svetnoy, chief electrician for Rust, said in a Facebook post on Sunday that he had held Hutchins his arms while she was dying and blamed 'negligence and unprofessionalism' for her death.

Several members of the camera crew walked off the production in a dispute over payment and lodging, Russell said, and he was left with a lot of work to do. Only one camera was available to shoot, and it had to be moved because the light had shifted and there was a shadow.
_____________________

The fatal shooting and previous experiences point to larger safety issues that need to be addressed, Goll said, adding that crew member safety and wellbeing were top issues in recent contract negotiations between a union that represents film and TV workers and a major producers' group.”

______________________

The assistant director on Rust [who handed Baldwin the gun and told him it was “Cold”] has been accused of making a string of gun-safety gaffes on a prior production - and was also said to have made staff feel uncomfortable with his 'touchy' behavior.

Complaints against Dave Halls were made by prop maker and pyrotechnician Maggie Goll after working on him on a previous production with him on Hulu in 2019 called Into the Dark.

In Goll's statement to CNN, she claimed that Halls never addressed weapon safety protocols in production meetings or when a firearm was to be used on the set.

Goll also said that she was told to 'watch out' for him by another crew member as Halls apparently tended to get touchy with them.

In reference to her experience on Into the Dark, Goll said she had worked with Halls between February to May of 2019 where he had neglected to hold production meetings to follow standard weapon safety protocols.

Those stipulate that any weapon being used on a set - real or fake - must be 'introduced' to the cast and the crew so that they are aware of its presence, and can follow other safety protocols.

'The only reason the crew was made aware of a weapon's presence was because the assistant prop master demanded Dave acknowledge and announce the situation each day,' Goll said in the statement.

She also added that the prop master would reprimand Halls for not acknowledging the protocol.

Another unnamed crew member had also said that Halls would only hold short meetings about guns as necessary, but would often question why he was holding them as he said the protocols were the same as on every other film set.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

so according to the cameraman, the camera was not rolling, Alec was practicing a draw with a weapon he believed was unloaded.

The head armorer on set was a 24-year-old woman on her second job as a set armorer.

 

[kdonnel]

so according to the cameraman, the camera was not rolling, Alec was practicing a draw with a weapon he believed was unloaded.

The head armorer on set was a 24-year-old woman on her second job as a set armorer.

That sounds like besides failing to verify the firearm was clear, Alec violated several other firearm safety rules. Muzzle control, know your backstop, don't point it any anything you don't want to kill.

Completely reckless.

 

[TLSnell1981]

I have not read all the replies, but…

If someone, even a profesional, handed you a gun and said “this is an unloaded (cold) gun”, would you then point it at someone and pull the trigger?

No I would not. Some say it's normal procedure on set although I have read contradicting statements. And I will take it one further. How many would hold it to their own head and pull the trigger without seeing the weapon cleared? Again, no way in this world would I do it.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

No I would not. Some say it's normal procedure on set although I have read contradicting statements. And I will take it one further. How many would hold it to their own head and pull the trigger without seeing the weapon cleared? Again, no way in this world would I do it.

I think I’d prefer to work with Ray Liotta.

 

[Sinder]

How many people claiming Alec Baldwin had no responsibility himself to check it because there’s other people to do that are the same people who support “common sense” gun laws?
Here’s some common sense- never assume a firearm is unloaded, always confirm for yourself. No person handling a firearm should be relying on anyone else to tell them it is. Especially if you are about to point it in a direction that isnt clear of people, which is of course you should never ever do in the first place if your “prop” gun is a real firearm.

 

[dvcgirl67]

How many people claiming Alec Baldwin had no responsibility himself to check it because there’s other people to do that are the same people who support “common sense” gun laws?
Here’s some common sense- never assume a firearm is unloaded, always confirm for yourself. No person handling a firearm should be relying on anyone else to tell them it is. Especially if you are about to point it in a direction that isnt clear of people, which is of course you should never ever do in the first place if your “prop” gun is a real firearm.

I heard that there was an interview with Baldwin prior to this shoot where he was asked about his comfort level on a western. I only read the interview, but didn't hear it myself. But it something to the effect that he comes from the "old school" and has skills like horse riding and "gun play" at his fingertips. I didn't go through his movies, but for sure he has handled guns on several other movies in his career. I would think he's familiar with the process of how these things are done on a movie set. All of this feels like a tragic workplace accident than a debate over the issue of "common sense gun laws" in our country. As someone who isn't a fan of guns at all....when I hear "common sense" laws around guns, it's much more than someone checking the chamber to see if there are bullets in it. It's more about the proliferation of the gun culture....etc. As for this awful outcome.....today the press seems to be pointing squarely at the assistant director. There are people who worked with him on other sets, some fairly high up in a production....who are saying he takes chances with safety. For those really going after Baldwin in the press...and in this thread....etc. Insert your favorite actor into this situation and see what you think. He's not my favorite actor...but just trying to make a point. What if it was Clint Eastwood? Should he be locked up too? Just curious if some would go as hard for him as they would for Baldwin.

 

[dominiondad]

I heard that there was an interview with Baldwin prior to this shoot where he was asked about his comfort level on a western. I only read the interview, but didn't hear it myself. But it something to the effect that he comes from the "old school" and has skills like horse riding and "gun play" at his fingertips. I didn't go through his movies, but for sure he has handled guns on several other movies in his career. I would think he's familiar with the process of how these things are done on a movie set. All of this feels like a tragic workplace accident than a debate over the issue of "common sense gun laws" in our country. As someone who isn't a fan of guns at all....when I hear "common sense" laws around guns, it's much more than someone checking the chamber to see if there are bullets in it. It's more about the proliferation of the gun culture....etc. As for this awful outcome.....today the press seems to be pointing squarely at the assistant director. There are people who worked with him on other sets, some fairly high up in a production....who are saying he takes chances with safety. For those really going after Baldwin in the press...and in this thread....etc. Insert your favorite actor into this situation and see what you think. He's not my favorite actor...but just trying to make a point. What if it was Clint Eastwood? Should he be locked up too? Just curious if some would go as hard for him as they would for Baldwin.

To answer the question, yes any actor or person. But keep in mind, Baldwin was not just an actor and shooter, he was also one of the producers. He's responsible for the entire process on set.

 

[leeniewdw]

He's not my favorite actor...but just trying to make a point. What if it was Clint Eastwood? Should he be locked up too? Just curious if some would go as hard for him as they would for Baldwin.

This made me think, what if it's had been a huge name actor (say Eastwood) that had been injured/killed. How much of the "workplace accident" thought is because the victim isn't a person known by the general public.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Why would an actor, during a rehearsal, two-step **** and fire a gun in the direction of people, or toward a camera, when industry safety standards forbid this, even using “cold” guns?

 

[Sinder]

I heard that there was an interview with Baldwin prior to this shoot where he was asked about his comfort level on a western. I only read the interview, but didn't hear it myself. But it something to the effect that he comes from the "old school" and has skills like horse riding and "gun play" at his fingertips. I didn't go through his movies, but for sure he has handled guns on several other movies in his career. I would think he's familiar with the process of how these things are done on a movie set. All of this feels like a tragic workplace accident than a debate over the issue of "common sense gun laws" in our country. As someone who isn't a fan of guns at all....when I hear "common sense" laws around guns, it's much more than someone checking the chamber to see if there are bullets in it. It's more about the proliferation of the gun culture....etc. As for this awful outcome.....today the press seems to be pointing squarely at the assistant director. There are people who worked with him on other sets, some fairly high up in a production....who are saying he takes chances with safety. For those really going after Baldwin in the press...and in this thread....etc. Insert your favorite actor into this situation and see what you think. He's not my favorite actor...but just trying to make a point. What if it was Clint Eastwood? Should he be locked up too? Just curious if some would go as hard for him as they would for Baldwin.

I’m not debating gun laws, I think my point is very clear. What I see is a lot of people without any knowledge of guns talking about common sense gun laws. Then something like this happens and those same people ignore the very idea that common sense says ANYONE handling a firearm is ultimately responsible for using it. They are responsible for checking to make sure it is safe to use, especially in an environment where other people could be injured or killed if you don’t.

I don’t care who the actor is, if they are using a gun in their profession then they should be required to know how to use it, which includes the common sense rules of “there’s no such thing as an unloaded gun” until you confirm for yourself that it is.

 

[BrianL]

To answer the question, yes any actor or person. But keep in mind, Baldwin was not just an actor and shooter, he was also one of the producers. He's responsible for the entire process on set.

Yes, this is definitely an important point. While I don't blame him directly for the weapon discharging, as a producer he does bare responsibility for issues on set, which apparently were numerous. That aspect will land on him and the other producers and supervisors.

 

[toolmanjan]

Bottom line when someone hands you a fire arm you verify that it's not loaded, the camber is empty and the magazine is empty.
Never aim a firearm at anyone even if you have verified. NEVER NEVER NEVER!

 

[TwoMisfits]

I heard that there was an interview with Baldwin prior to this shoot where he was asked about his comfort level on a western. I only read the interview, but didn't hear it myself. But it something to the effect that he comes from the "old school" and has skills like horse riding and "gun play" at his fingertips. I didn't go through his movies, but for sure he has handled guns on several other movies in his career. I would think he's familiar with the process of how these things are done on a movie set. All of this feels like a tragic workplace accident than a debate over the issue of "common sense gun laws" in our country. As someone who isn't a fan of guns at all....when I hear "common sense" laws around guns, it's much more than someone checking the chamber to see if there are bullets in it. It's more about the proliferation of the gun culture....etc. As for this awful outcome.....today the press seems to be pointing squarely at the assistant director. There are people who worked with him on other sets, some fairly high up in a production....who are saying he takes chances with safety. For those really going after Baldwin in the press...and in this thread....etc. Insert your favorite actor into this situation and see what you think. He's not my favorite actor...but just trying to make a point. What if it was Clint Eastwood? Should he be locked up too? Just curious if some would go as hard for him as they would for Baldwin.

If Clint was also a producer, HELL YES!! And the charges being considered by most (New Mexico's felony involuntary manslaughter) are those that run 6-18 months in prison, so the "teach the lesson, but don't ruin your life permanently" kind, but also make sure Alec would not possess weapons again, b/c he obviously is not careful enough to do so responsibly.

 

[JimMIA]

I've seen one report that said they were NOT filming when the shooting occurred.

It said they were trying to reposition the camera due to shifting light where they were shooting. Baldwin was supposed to cross-draw the gun (from left hip with right hand if he's right-handed), swing it across his body, but not fire. He was supposedly demonstrating that move for the director of photography to check the lighting, and the gun was fired.

If that scenario is what actually happened, it is way beyond careless.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

^ I was just reading about cross draw. Not something I’m familiar with, but lots to know.

https://www.craftholsters.com/deeper-look-cross-draw-holsters-pros-cons-more

 

[Sinder]

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/alec-baldwin-accidental-shooting-details-halyna-hutchins-death
According to a search warrant executed by the Santa Fe County Sheriff's office, obtained by Fox News, the actor and crew were setting up a shot that required Baldwin to cross-draw a revolver and point the weapon at the camera. However, thanks to a shadow that was coming into the church structure from light outside, the camera had to be adjusted to a different angle. Baldwin was working with the director and the cinematographer demonstrating how he was going to draw his revolver from its holster and where his arm would be for the new shot. While demonstrating, the firearm went off.

I read an article earlier that said the revolver used was in single action mode. I can't find it to link it.

Firearms don't "go off". The trigger has to be pulled. A revolver can work in double action or single action. In double action pulling the trigger would be "heavy" because you are cocking the hammer and then dropping the hammer (strikes the primer) when you pull the trigger. If the revolver has already been "cocked" manually then it is being shot single action, so when you pull the trigger it only drops the hammer therefore it's lighter (a little easier to pull). That is what I think they mean by it "went off".
Mr. Baldwin was cross drawing so he was pulling the gun from the opposite side of his shooting hand. If the gun was put in single action mode and he had his hand on the trigger while practicing he could have pulled it as he was drawing causing it to fire. It still could have happened in double action mode but the trigger would be a little harder to pull and you would know you pulled it, you wouldn't think that it just "went off".
Bottom line is another common sense gun safety rule was not applied here- never put your finger on the trigger until your target is in your sight. You don't draw your gun with your finger on the trigger ever.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/alec-baldwin-accidental-shooting-details-halyna-hutchins-death
According to a search warrant executed by the Santa Fe County Sheriff's office, obtained by Fox News, the actor and crew were setting up a shot that required Baldwin to cross-draw a revolver and point the weapon at the camera. However, thanks to a shadow that was coming into the church structure from light outside, the camera had to be adjusted to a different angle. Baldwin was working with the director and the cinematographer demonstrating how he was going to draw his revolver from its holster and where his arm would be for the new shot. While demonstrating, the firearm went off.

I read an article earlier that said the revolver used was in single action mode. I can't find it to link it.

Firearms don't "go off". The trigger has to be pulled. A revolver can work in double action or single action. In double action pulling the trigger would be "heavy" because you are cocking the hammer and then dropping the hammer (strikes the primer) when you pull the trigger. If the revolver has already been "cocked" manually then it is being shot single action, so when you pull the trigger it only drops the hammer therefore it's lighter (a little easier to pull). That is what I think they mean by it "went off".
Mr. Baldwin was cross drawing so he was pulling the gun from the opposite side of his shooting hand. If the gun was put in single action mode and he had his hand on the trigger while practicing he could have pulled it as he was drawing causing it to fire. It still could have happened in double action mode but the trigger would be a little harder to pull and you would know you pulled it, you wouldn't think that it just "went off".
Bottom line is another common sense gun safety rule was not applied here- never put your finger on the trigger until your target is in your sight. You don't draw your gun with your finger on the trigger ever.

Ok, that makes more sense. Thanks for posting