Coming from NY. This is horrible

[JimMIA]

Hey! That was for me.

You snooze, you lose!

 

[kandb]

Yes, while the total population of NY state is 19.1 million people. Approximately only 3% of the cases and deaths happened in upstate NY.

Meanwhile 97% of the cases and deaths happened in the 8.5 million people in NYC due to the density of the population. People living and working on top of each other, and traveling via mass transit that placed them in tightly confined spaces, where there is little to no social distancing. It caused people to inhale high infectious doses from being that densely packed, moving about with no masks for the first 49 days.

Since the whole state was given the same info and state-wide mandates, if the density of environment wasn't such a strong factor, the rest of the state would have had the same percentage in numbers of cases and deaths. The only times the state split and did something different is when we reopened in different Phases.




One also has to factor in how little medical info about COVID-19 we had back in March & April. Our knowledge, or rather our lack of knowledge determined how we acted. What we are doing has changed so much since.

Back then, we didn't know:

​

• How far we had to socially distance: That it was only transmitted through coughing & sneezing and we only had to stay about 3 ft away from each other. And stay out of the way of people's coughs and sneezes. That the COVID particles are big and dropped down very quickly. Jimmy Kimmel, on his talk show, even came up with a new greeting called the "El-Bump" where one only had to turn their faces away from each other and bump elbows. It was a couple weeks before we knew to stay 6 ft apart.​

​

• COVID-19 is aerosolized/airborne: We were originally told that it was not airborne. Now we know small particles linger in the air for 3 hours or more and can travel, especially indoors via air conditioning or ventilation. Masks are extremely crucial to stop the aerosolized/airborne spread. It was 49 days from the first confirmed case in NY to the mandate to wear masks. During those 49 days, the cases and subsequent deaths climbed and reached their apex. The numbers went down dramatically after that.​

​

• There are people who are asymptomatic: They present NO symptoms, yet are highly contagious.​

​

• Viral load, also known as infectious dose: The amount of an infectious dose one is exposed to can determine how sick one becomes.​

​

• NYC didn't have some of the medical techniques that now have saved many COVID patients from death. It was thought that the worst cases had to be put immediately on ventilators. Now, there is the technique of proning, using the drug Remdesivir which may cut the duration of severe cases down by 60%. And probably other techniques not mentioned.​

Yes, NYC did have alot of cases due to the density of the population But don't forget about the governor sending the elderly, who had COVID back into nursing homes/assisted livings (where the most vulnerable are) and many cases/deaths resulted by that horrible move. This was after the governor asked the federal government for the military ship/hospital that barely any patients ever used! Terrible.

 

[CarolAnn856]

What happened to people talking civilly to others??? Carol Ann get some therapy for your anger!

Oh honey, I’m not angry with you. I’m just incredulous that you thought that wasn’t common knowledge. Now, if folks pointing out to you things that you are misinformed about is causing you to feel stressed, take a breather.

The goal is for everyone to do the right thing, whether it’s a policy maker or general citizen. And the only way that can happen is if people are well-informed. When you post incorrect info or try to use old info as if it were a new revelation, it shows that you need to become better informed. Sure, folks, including me, may speak (or type) more casually when we do that, but that’s pretty much the norm around here.

If that’s too much for you, it might be better to stick with the more fluffy threads for a bit. Nothing wrong with stepping away when stressed. We’ve all been there, done that.

 

[snowwhite84]

Yes, NYC did have alot of cases due to the density of the population But don't forget about the governor sending the elderly, who had COVID back into nursing homes/assisted livings (where the most vulnerable are) and many cases/deaths resulted by that horrible move. This was after the governor asked the federal government for the military ship/hospital that barely any patients ever used! Terrible.

Are you trying to say that NY made mistakes, so Florida should get a pass?

I think what a lot of people on this thread are trying to say is: NY went through a really tough time, now it seems Florida is headed the same direction, learn from the past!

 

[Imzadi]

Yes, NYC did have alot of cases due to the density of the population But don't forget about the governor sending the elderly, who had COVID back into nursing homes/assisted livings (where the most vulnerable are) and many cases/deaths resulted by that horrible move.

The fact is: while NY had the most nursing home deaths. It's due to being the former COVID epicenter of the world, and had the most deaths overall - again due to the density of population in NYC. Percentage-wise, NY is well below most states in terms of nursing home deaths due to COVID-19. It actually ranks 44th out of 50 states.

ALL the states and ALL the Governors and nursing homes made mistakes. How could they not? This was an impossible situation. NO ONE has been through this before. Before anyone goes flaming any states, as I said in an earlier post, they all did the best they could, due to the limited knowledge by the CDC, the World Health Organization and Dr. Fauci, in the beginning few months.


Below from: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-nursing-homes.html

More Than 40% of U.S. Coronavirus Deaths Are Linked to Nursing Homes

(Click to enlarge map & chart)

 

[Imzadi]

But don't forget about the governor sending the elderly, who had COVID back into nursing homes/assisted livings (where the most vulnerable are) and many cases/deaths resulted by that horrible move. This was after the governor asked the federal government for the military ship/hospital that barely any patients ever used! Terrible.

Actually the move back to nursing homes DIDN'T cause other nursing home deaths. This was unfortunately when scientists didn't know that people could be asymptomatic.

The NY State Dept of Health released a report on July 6.

Full Report at:
https://www.health.ny.gov/press/releases/2020/2020-07-06_covid19_nursing_home_report.htm

<Snipped section>

ALBANY, N.Y. (July 6, 2020) - The New York State Department of Health today released results of an in-depth analysis of nursing home data that found COVID-19 fatalities in nursing homes were related to infected nursing home staff. The full report can be found here.​

​

David L. Reich MD, President and COO of The Mount Sinai Hospital, said: "Mount Sinai scientists published a report last week, demonstrating the presence of antibodies to SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, in saved blood specimens as early as the week ending February 23. This means that the virus was spreading in the NYC metropolitan region approximately three weeks earlier. The conclusions of the NYSDOH report of the root causes of nursing home fatalities in New York State are well supported by the data detailing nursing home staff COVID-19 illness, and epidemiological patterns, especially considering evidence of the duration of contagiousness for COVID-19 patients. We all hope to learn from these data and work with NYSDOH and nursing home partners to maximize safety for our most vulnerable citizens as this pandemic continues to evolve."​

​

Mr. Michael Dowling, CEO, Northwell Health, said: "This important data-based study confirms what we saw in our own facilities and around the state --that when the virus hit our local communities, it quickly spread through asymptomatic carriers into our nursing homes, hospitals, places of worship and other congregate settings. This study highlighted a critically important fact that the overwhelming majority of hospital patients sent back into nursing homes were not only medically stable, they were no longer contagious, and that 81 percent of the nursing homes receiving COVID patients from New York's hospitals already had the virus. This rigorous, fact-driven analysis provides critical insight as we move forward into the next phase of this pandemic and continue to look for new ways to improve health outcomes for patients."​

​

The executive summary to the report is below:​

​

In an effort to learn for the future from the data now available from the earliest days of the first in a century pandemic that swept across the globe and into the United States, the New York State Department of Health (NYSDOH) conducted an in-depth analysis of self-reported nursing home data that finds that COVID-19 fatalities in nursing homes were related to infected nursing home staff. The NYSDOH analysis found:​

• The timing of staff infections correlates with the timing of peak nursing home resident mortality across the state;
• Nursing home employee infections were related to the most impacted regions in the state;
• Peak nursing home admissions occurred a week after peak nursing home mortality, therefore illustrating that nursing home admissions from hospitals were not a driver of nursing home infections or fatalities;
• Most patients admitted to nursing homes from hospitals were no longer contagious when admitted and therefore were not a source of infection; and,
• Nursing home quality was not a factor in nursing home fatalities.

According to data submitted by nursing homes, in many cases under the penalty of perjury, approximately 37,500 nursing home staff members — one in four of the state's approximately 158,000 nursing home workers — were infected with COVID-19 between March and early June 2020. Of the 37,500 nursing home staff infected, nearly 7,000 of them were working in facilities in the month of March; during the same period, more than a third of the state's nursing home facilities had residents ill with the virus. Roughly 20,000 infected nursing home workers were known to be COVID-positive by the end of the month of April. These workforce infections are reflective of the larger geographic impact of the virus's presence across the state.​

​

NYSDOH further analyzed the timing of the COVID-positive staff infections and the timing of nursing home deaths. Based on published data, the average length of time between COVID-19 infections to death is between 18-25 days.[1] Therefore, the link between the timing of staff infection and nursing home mortality is supported by the fact that the peak number of nursing home staff reported COVID-19 symptoms on March 16, 2020 — 23 days prior to the date of the peak nursing home fatalities, which occurred on April 8, 2020. It is likely that thousands of employees who were infected in mid-March transmitted the virus unknowingly — through no fault of their own — while working, which then led to resident infection.​

​

.

 

[Imzadi]

This was after the governor asked the federal government for the military ship/hospital that barely any patients ever used! Terrible.

As for the USNS Comfort, it is a federal ship and a military ship. BOTH had certain restrictions and severely limited HOW the ship was able to be used.

It was originally requested to be used for the overflow of NON-Covid patients. So the hospitals could use more floors as COVID floors. Due to everyone quarantining, there turned out to be almost no accidents or other illnesses. So, the Comfort wasn't needed for that. The Gov. then requested that the Comfort be refitted for COVID patients. POTUS agreed. The Comfort was refitted from a 1000 patient facility to 500 to fit all the COVID equipment.

Unfortunately, due to being a military ship, it's regulations did not allow ANY patients to be transferred from another facility - either patients or nursing home patients. It could only accept new patients. Unfortunately, when ambulances picked up COVID patients from homes, they usually couldn't bring COVID patients to the Comfort, as it was next to impossible to move the gurney onto the ship. A patient had to be able to WALK themselves onto the ship. That usually wasn't COVID patients. That was WHY the Comfort was originally fitted as a Non-COVID facility. And why it ended up being barely used at all.

As you are supposed to be so up on data, I'm surprised you don't already know this. Terrible!!! Terrible!!!

 

[Imzadi]

NYC has hit a milestone this weekend! We've had NO COVID deaths for the first time in 4 months.

The state has been hovering down around 5-7 deaths per day for a while now. Of course, zero deaths won't last, as long as COVID is around. Yet, it's nice to finally hit this day once.

 

[CarolAnn856]

Also, I am in NJ. The governor has mandated face coverings are worn outside. I was at the beach yesterday and in a heavily outdoor area (people walking, jogging and biking) and I did not see one person with a face covering on.

Granted, there are lots of people who can't social distance and are still not wearing masks outdoors, and perhaps that is that the poster is referring to. However, for the benefit of anyone who might read this, I'd like to clarify that the bolded above is misleading. The outdoor mask mandate is for when you cannot practice social distancing. You are not required to have a mask on every time you step foot outside, as the post implies.

 

[dvcgirl67]

NYC has hit a milestone this weekend! We've had NO COVID deaths for the first time in 4 months.

The state has been hovering down around 5-7 deaths per day for a while now. Of course, zero deaths won't last, as long as COVID is around. Yet, it's nice to finally hit this day once.

I saw this yesterday. Such a great milestone in this whole mess.

 

[lovin'fl]

NYC has hit a milestone this weekend! We've had NO COVID deaths for the first time in 4 months.

The state has been hovering down around 5-7 deaths per day for a while now. Of course, zero deaths won't last, as long as COVID is around. Yet, it's nice to finally hit this day once.

But gun violence there this weekend was high. Especially sad for the 1 year old victim.

 

[snowwhite84]

But gun violence there this weekend was high. Especially sad for the 1 year old victim.

Do you think gun violence is worse in NY than in Florida?

 

[lovin'fl]

Do you think gun violence is worse in NY than in Florida?

I am just saying NY shouldn't pat itself on the back for such a great week.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

Gun violence has nothing to do with a discussion of public health.

 

[snowwhite84]

I am just saying NY shouldn't pat itself on the back for such a great week.

New Yorkers shouldn’t feel happy that after months of terror we had a day with some good news? Are you not pleased that New Yorkers, your fellow Americans, have for the moment gotten this nightmare under control?

 

[lovin'fl]

Gun violence has nothing to do with a discussion of public health.

Innocent 1 year old dying isn't a public health issue?

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

It sounds like y'all are jealous of New York Maybe take a breather.

 

[snowwhite84]

Innocent 1 year old dying isn't a public health issue?

You’re making a straw man argument. Of course a one year old dying is a tragedy. But that’s not a crisis unique to NY. Year after year, NY has one of the lowest records of gun deaths in the country. Florida can’t say the same, which gives me no pleasure to say.

 

[Imzadi]

I am just saying NY shouldn't pat itself on the back for such a great week.

It's not like this is an either/or situation. We NYers are capable of feeling joy and relief for a milestone regarding one of the worst crises this city has suffered, AND feel sad for the loss of a life.

Sorry, you are not capable of that.

 

[robinb]

Gun violence has nothing to do with a discussion of public health.

IMO gun ownership and violence should be a public health discussion.