Coming from NY. This is horrible

[roomthreeseventeen]

There is no evidence of people having none! I would imagine people who have had it and have antibodies (tho not everyone), would do better if they were exposed again but if you have some statistics contradicting this, please share!

This is not true, we know this because we know you can get the thing, recover, test negative, and then test positive again.

 

[kandb]

You don't understand what herd immunity (or immunity) means.

THERE IS NO IMMUNITY. If you get it, you are not immune to getting it a second time.

Please, give us your statistics on this!!! Does it say that if someone gets it a second time, they don't have a better outcome??? Also, for some who are testing positive after numerous times, they are unsure if the virus has just not left the body. It lingers for a minority of people, which is troubling!

 

[kandb]

This is not true, we know this because we know you can get the thing, recover, test negative, and then test positive again.

I don't believe they are sure if it's because it just hasn't left the body as opposed to a new infection.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

OK, there's literally no use of all of us arguing with this person who thinks that there's herd immunity despite every medical professional saying there isn't.

 

[JimMIA]

Yes, you can.
We were planning a trip to Nashville to celebrate our 30th anniversary in late summer -- but we're staying home. Outright cancelled. No substitute trip on the horizon.

It's not fun, but until this virus is stopped, it's the right thing to do.

And keep in mind that the celebration is not the important thing. The important thing is the thirty years!

Happy Anniversary!

 

[Jennasis]

OK, there's literally no use of all of us arguing with this person who thinks that there's herd immunity despite every medical professional saying there isn't.

I probably should have used more exclamation points.

 

[kandb]

Yep there is some people dumb enough to get it twice. You will think they would of learned their lesson the first time.

Dumb people??? What a ignorant statement!!! Do you know how many people got it from working in healthcare or going to the grocery store or got it from a family member who is a essential worker??? I shake my head how nasty people are lately!!!

 

[kandb]

I probably should have used more exclamation points.

Calm down. Do exclamation points really bother you that much?? If they do, do some soul searching!

 

[JimMIA]

That's enough!!!!! Bye-bye!!!!!

 

[Jennasis]

Calm down. Do exclamation points really bother you that much?? If they do, do some soul searching!

You win the internet today. Oh, and welcome to my ignore list.

 

[TippyThomas]

I don't believe they are sure if it's because it just hasn't left the body as opposed to a new infection.

Could you provide a cite as to who the 'they' are you're referring to?

 

[kandb]

There was nothing that @CarolAnn856 said that was angry or nasty. @JimMIA stated an opinion that I agree with. And it was not nasty or mean in any way. The only person who seems angry is you. We went through this on another thread yesterday, but your excessive use of punctuation comes across as yelling and anger. If you don’t want to be taken that way, calm it down.

And then just some personal advice. These boards can get heated. We are a passionate group with strong feelings. It works better if you have a thick skin and can learn to not take anything personally. And realize many of us are just having a conversation or debate, not fighting.

You're in the group of your angry little army on here!!! All good. I am glad you guys are all medical experts and know more then doctors/scientists! There is so much they do not know about this virus but you and your little group seem to know it all!!! I will ask you this. If there is no immunity, what do you believe our country can do, stay home til it goes away??? Is that realistic? You do know they had the shutdown in NY/NJ to not overwhelm the medical community. What happens if this virus stays around for 5 years? or more? Please, post scientific evidence that states there is definitely no immunity to this virus at all? If someone has had it and recovered, they are not better off then someone who has never been exposed??? Please enlighten us!

 

[kandb]

Could you provide a cite as to who the 'they' are you're referring to?

I have read alot about this illness, as I am sure most have and as far as I have read, they are NOT sure about immunity/antibodies etc. Please post about people with COVID have no immunity!

 

[LilyWDW]

OK, there's literally no use of all of us arguing with this person who thinks that there's herd immunity despite every medical professional saying there isn't.

If people are unwilling to listen and learn then you are correct. No use.

There is no herd immunity anywhere at this point. Even taking out the problem that we have NO PROOF that having the virus actually gives any sort of immunity or for how long, the sheer numbers are not there. A LOT more people would have to be infected. Like 70% of the population. The US has about 328 Million people (2019). That is 229 MILLION people that would have to be infected to reach herd immunity numbers. Right now, the US is looking at about a 4% case fatality rate. If that rate keeps, that is another 9 MILLION people that would have to die. Not to mention the people who suffer life long complications from stroke, blood clots, lung damage, heart damage, neurological damage, and so much more.

So is herd immunity even worth it?

 

[Imzadi]

Numbers and data mean absolutely nothing on their own. It is the analysis that counts. [. . .] Cherry picking New York's high total case and death counts which includes figures from months ago is not even remotely a clear indicator of what is happening now.

Yes, while the total population of NY state is 19.1 million people. Approximately only 3% of the cases and deaths happened in upstate NY.

Meanwhile 97% of the cases and deaths happened in the 8.5 million people in NYC due to the density of the population. People living and working on top of each other, breathing in the same reconditioned, ventilated air indoors. And traveling via mass transit that placed them in tightly confined spaces, where there is little to no social distancing. It caused people to inhale high infectious doses from being that densely packed, moving about with no masks for the first 49 days.

Since the whole state was given the same info and state-wide mandates, if the density of environment wasn't such a strong factor, the rest of the state would have had the same percentage in numbers of cases and deaths. The only times the state split and did something different is when we reopened in different Phases.

But... the other very important thing to consider is the majority of NY cases happened months ago and most of the deaths related have happened already. The majority of FL cases are happening right now and the related deaths have yet to play out.

One also has to factor in how little medical info about COVID-19 we had back in March & April. Our knowledge, or rather our lack of knowledge determined how we acted, and thus many still got inadvertently exposed. What we are doing has changed so much since.

Back then, we didn't know:

​

• How far we had to socially distance: Originally, the virus was thought to only be transmitted through coughing & sneezing and we only had to stay about 3 ft away from each other. And stay out of the way of people's coughs and sneezes. That the COVID particles are big and dropped down very quickly. Jimmy Kimmel, on his talk show, even came up with a new greeting called the "El-Bump" where one only had to turn their faces away from each other and bump elbows. It was a couple weeks before we knew to stay 6 ft apart.​

​

• COVID-19 is aerosolized/airborne: We were originally told that it was not airborne. Now we know small particles linger in the air for 3 hours or more and can travel, especially indoors via air conditioning or ventilation. Masks are extremely crucial to stop the aerosolized/airborne spread. It was 49 days from the first confirmed case in NY to the mandate to wear masks. During those 49 days, the cases and subsequent deaths climbed and reached their apex. The numbers went down dramatically after that.​

​

• There are people who are asymptomatic: They present NO symptoms, yet are highly contagious. Doing temperature checks on them is useless.​

​

• Viral load, also known as infectious dose: The amount of an infectious dose one is exposed to can determine how sick one becomes.​

​

• NYC didn't have some of the medical techniques that now have saved many COVID patients from death. It was thought that the worst cases had to be put immediately on ventilators. Now, there is the technique of proning - turning a person onto their stomachs, which takes pressure off their lungs. They can then breathe by being given oxygen, instead of being put on a ventilator. Using the drug Remdesivir which may cut the duration of severe cases down by 60%. And probably other techniques not mentioned.​

 

[Imzadi]

OK, there's literally no use of all of us arguing with this person

Yes, many of you should go over to this other thread for an entertaining read by this person. (Although, I got bored eventually.

) You don't even have to start at the beginning of the thread, only where they enter the conversation. Bring a cocktail to read along.

https://www.disboards.com/threads/this-is-such-a-sad-sick-world.3807077/page-9

 

[MATTERHORN]

I live here and I agree, Florida is doing a TERRIBLE job. It doesn't do any good to have every single city and county having different rules. They need to start enforcing things with fines.

 

[Imzadi]

There is no herd immunity anywhere at this point. Even taking out the problem that we have NO PROOF that having the virus actually gives any sort of immunity or for how long, the sheer numbers are not there. A LOT more people would have to be infected. Like 70% of the population. The US has about 328 Million people (2019). That is 229 MILLION people that would have to be infected to reach herd immunity numbers. Right now, the US is looking at about a 4% case fatality rate. If that rate keeps, that is another 9 MILLION people that would have to die. Not to mention the people who suffer life long complications from stroke, blood clots, lung damage, heart damage, neurological damage, and so much more.

So is herd immunity even worth it?

NYC only has 26% of the population that has COVID-19 antibodies, according to the state-wide tests done. We lost way too many people. And now there is evidence of long-term illnesses in many who have survived COVID. They didn't even have severe cases, nor had high risk factors.

 

[kandb]

Also, I am in NJ. The governor has mandated face coverings are worn outside. I was at the beach yesterday and in a heavily outdoor area (people walking, jogging and biking) and I did not see one person with a face covering on.

 

[LilyWDW]

Oh... and if we want to talk about New York City since one poster seems SO sure about herd immunity there...

All data from the NYC Health Department btw and was updated as of today.

Cases: 215,924
Deaths (confirmed and probable): 23,283
Population: 8.399 MILLION

No where close to herd immunity...