Disney Riviera Resort

[MickeyMinnieMom]

But if their data is telling them that DVCers really would value such a proposition and pay extra for it, then they'd do it.

Agreed. I'd be willing to bet that such data doesn't exist, though. Don't see the value -- at all. Only the downsides.

 

[Madonna3]

We go through every so often. Many members (Andrew and I for example) picked up a lot contracts (not sure how many Andrew did) when they were in the $40 to $60 range.

Ok that's different. Those were being sold half of their going resale rate. You can't buy a Copper Creek contract right now and turn around and sell it for double. You can even sell a Poly contract right now for double. If anything, contracts LOSE their initial value. I have yet to see one that has retained any value.

 

[dlavender]

We go through every so often. Many members (Andrew and I for example) picked up a lot contracts (not sure how many Andrew did) when they were in the $40 to $60 range.

I wonder what the original purchase price was on those....

The other side of that coin, some people played the game and lost.....

Perhaps not a sure thing?

 

[Madonna3]

Yeah, I couldn't really see them letting potential customers gondola on by without "allowing" them to enter the shiny building and pick out their "exclusive" DRR mug....

And not being able to rent out your place would probably be a negative, but they probably want to start stomping that out one day anyway.

But if their data is telling them that DVCers really would value such a proposition and pay extra for it, then they'd do it.

Exactly, making DVC resorts exclusive would wipe out the rental market and that's a market I would happily see go. However, they could open the resort to public bookings. I absolutely think the demand for exclusivity lies within the DVC community. You think I'm outlandish, but the more I think about it, while I don't think it's completely probable, I do see it as possible and if the whole resort isn't off limits, I wonder if some of it would be.

Tell me, would you want to share a monorail from GF with Pop!?

ETA: I'm talking more to MickeyMinnieMom than I am you Dlavender. I just used your post.

 

[dlavender]

Ok that's different. Those were being sold half of their going resale rate. You can't buy a Copper Creek contract right now and turn around and sell it for double. You can even sell a Poly contract right now for double. If anything, contracts LOSE their initial value. I have yet to see one that has retained any value.

I suggest reading: "Get a time machine, go back to 2008, buy DVC contracts, retire early and handsomely" by J1.

 

[nkosiek]

They are indeed worth double, many contracts are. I am far from alone.

I'm sorry, but this is false in regards to a VGF contract. They were sold at $140+, and there is no contract out there that are worth double that. He specifically pointed to that resort for $40k and you came back with an $80k sale price today. Ain't no contract worth $280/pt, so please stop.

 

[dlavender]

Agreed. I'd be willing to bet that such data doesn't exist, though. Don't see the value -- at all. Only the downsides.

Maybe, maybe not.

When we first heard rumors of a SW hotel, I, like many, were envisioning an Art of Animation type deal.

But right now, from early rumors, looks to be on the other scale. Higher end boutique.

Perhaps that's where this might be headed?

It's a little out there, but maybe not as far as we think.

 

[Madonna3]

Agreed. I'd be willing to bet that such data doesn't exist, though. Don't see the value -- at all. Only the downsides.

completely disagree. Are you a DVC member? If you are, do you remember a survey a few years back asking about how DVC members could be appreciated? It mentioned exclusive events. A short time later, there's a member magic event at Typhoon Lagoon. It fills up. There's another one, it fills up. Then DVC puts out 2 dates at each park. ALL OF THEM FULL. Don't tell me there's not a demand for this and don't tell me DVC members wouldn't pay for it in terms of points/dues cause they will.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I absolutely think the demand for exclusivity lies within the DVC community.

I'd love to see a poll on this. Exclusive events? Sure. An exclusive hotel? Sincerely doubt it.

Just doesn't make sense from a business model standpoint to close a timeshare resort only to members. The economics are such that they also accept rack rate from whomever when rooms are available. Timeshares -- Disney and ALL OTHERS -- depend on this other revenue. Can't imagine why in the world they would give it up.

I'd love to run this by the timeshare developer I used to work for and see what he says!

 

[lockedoutlogic]

We go through every so often. Many members (Andrew and I for example) picked up a lot contracts (not sure how many Andrew did) when they were in the $40 to $60 range.

Yeah...but those old contracts weren't priced at $176 a night originally and most won't sell for $100 now.

The real value of resale is using it and getting your money back. Some of them sell over original price - beach club and boardwalk come to mind - and you make a nice walk away...

But double the price of recent hotels is not realistic.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

completely disagree. Are you a DVC member? If you are, do you remember a survey a few years back asking about how DVC members could be appreciated? It mentioned exclusive events. A short time later, there's a member magic event at Typhoon Lagoon. It fills up. There's another one, it fills up. Then DVC puts out 2 dates at each park. ALL OF THEM FULL. Don't tell me there's not a demand for this and don't tell me DVC members wouldn't pay for it in terms of points/dues cause they will.

You're not understanding what I'm saying. Exclusive events are ENTIRELY DIFFERENT than an exclusive resort. The economics don't work.

And I very much doubt that members give two hoots on the whole about only members staying in the rooms next to them.

I own a ton of points -- SSR since 2006 and BLT as soon as it started selling. I would pay $0 for an exclusive resort. And the surveys never asked about that -- wisely. They asked about exclusive EVENTS -- and that I'm all for.

 

[Madonna3]

I'd love to see a poll on this. Exclusive events? Sure. And exclusive hotel? Sincerely doubt it.

Just doesn't make sense from a business model standpoint to close a timeshare resort only to members. The economics are such that they also accept rack rate from whomever when rooms are available. Timeshares -- Disney and ALL OTHERS -- depend on this other revenue. Can't imagine why in the world they would give it up.

I'd love to run this by the timeshare developer I used to work for and see what he says!

I never said this WOULDN'T be the business model. I said it would be a DVC resort with amenties exclusive to DVC members, but could open it to public bookings. But the fact would remain, the amenities and resort would remain only to those staying there and other DVC members. Want to eat at the restaurant? Your membership card, please. Oh, you paid cash to stay here? Your magic band, please.

Go swim at the Beach Club pool when you're staying at Grand Floridian and see how that works out for you. The point is Disney does exclusivity based on demand.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Ok...I think if you integrate the new dvc with pop, Caribbean, and AoA...charge them $15000+ upfront and $7 a point a year...and have equal access to the onsite facilities...it's gonna be a disaster with the dvc mindset.

Has anyone ever gotten the impression that dvc members like Keeping to themselves while they're there?

I sure have...and this is new ground...even if you loosely connect it to the boardwalk area. I think it's telling that the gondola is an "axis" over victory way...allowing the crescent lake area a bit of a separation and make people "work"...aka walk...backwards to get to those areas.

 

[Madonna3]

You're not understanding what I'm saying. Exclusive events are ENTIRELY DIFFERENT than an exclusive resort. The economics don't work.

And I very much doubt that members give two hoots on the whole about only members staying in the rooms next to them.

I own a ton of points -- SSR since 2006 and BLT as soon as it started selling. I would pay $0 for an exclusive resort. And the surveys never asked about that -- wisely. They asked about exclusive EVENTS -- and that I'm all for.

You're so very wrong about this. I am part of several Facebook groups and they talk about this kind of thing on the daily.

 

[dlavender]

Yeah...but those old contracts weren't priced at $176 a night originally and most won't sell for $100 now.

The real value of resale is using it and getting your money back. Some of them sell over original price - beach club and boardwalk come to mind - and you make a nice walk away...

But double the price of recent hotels is not realistic.

Yeah, I don't see points going to $300/pp.

If anything, as time goes on and those 50 year contracts have 10 or so left, might have a flood of resale points driving them down.

Or by some evil economic force, they will be getting $300 per point and we will all work for J1.

 

[jade1]

Agreed the ship "currently" sailed on resale. Just saying when asked why "I don't question Disney pricing", I am saying I did.

Questioned rack rate and hedged with DVC.

Never expected it to work out that good I must admit.

 

[Roxyfire]

completely disagree. Are you a DVC member? If you are, do you remember a survey a few years back asking about how DVC members could be appreciated? It mentioned exclusive events. A short time later, there's a member magic event at Typhoon Lagoon. It fills up. There's another one, it fills up. Then DVC puts out 2 dates at each park. ALL OF THEM FULL. Don't tell me there's not a demand for this and don't tell me DVC members wouldn't pay for it in terms of points/dues cause they will.

Let me come at this from another side. They're doing a completely new build right? What's the one complaint about some of these new units. They're retrofitted into these old hotel rooms that are small. What if they made this a DVC exclusive resort, meaning you at least need to have a membership card of some kind, no renters. But the rooms are bigger due to it being a new build out. I don't know how much bigger, but enough to make people consider it, especially if they have teenagers or 3 kids or whatever. And the amenities are on par with what WL has now. Do you think that would be a big enough draw? I'm just kinda shooting in the dark here. I can see where you're going with it but it needs to set apart just enough from the more popular epcot resorts.

 

[Madonna3]

Ok...I think if you integrate the new dvc with pop, Caribbean, and AoA...charge them $15000+ upfront and $7 a point a year...and have equal access to the onsite facilities...it's gonna be a disaster with the dvc mindset.

Has anyone ever gotten the impression that dvc members like Keeping to themselves while they're there?

I sure have...and this is new ground...even if you loosely connect it to the boardwalk area. I think it's telling that the gondola is an "axis" over victory way...allowing the crescent lake area a bit of a separation and make people "work"...aka walk...backwards to get to those areas.

That's what I am saying. Making it DVC only or at least DDR only... that has a hook.

 

[Madonna3]

Let me come at this from another side. They're doing a completely new build right? What's the one complaint about some of these new units. They're retrofitted into these old hotel rooms that are small. What if they made this a DVC exclusive resort, meaning you at least need to have a membership card of some kind, no renters. But the rooms are bigger due to it being a new build out. I don't know how much bigger, but enough to make people consider it, especially if they have teenagers or 3 kids or whatever. And the amenities are on par with what WL has now. Do you think that would be a big enough draw? I'm just kinda shooting in the dark here. I can see where you're going with it but it needs to set apart just enough from the more popular epcot resorts.

I agree with that. But it still follows the logic of "DVC only", kinda going back to the old days before renters when OKW was DVC only. If they do this right, it will be a huge hook.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I never said this WOULDN'T be the business model. I said it would be a DVC resort with amenties exclusive to DVC members, but could open it to public bookings. But the fact would remain, the amenities and resort would remain only to those staying there and other DVC members. Want to eat at the restaurant? Your membership card, please. Oh, you paid cash to stay here? Your magic band, please.

Go swim at the Beach Club pool when you're staying at Grand Floridian and see how that works out for you. The point is Disney does exclusivity based on demand.

You were not at all clear to me.

So let's say non-members can have the pleasure of paying rack and staying there. Fabulous.

Would you like to gamble on your restaurant(s) staying booked ONLY WITH HOTEL GUESTS? Do you think the extra $$ they could extract by telling prospective DRR members: "no one else can eat at YOUR restaurant!!" would balance that out?

How awesome would that restaurant have to be for anyone to care?? V&A level?

I still don't see it. At all.