No the Magic isn’t gone but it’s at 25%

[Miffy]

I watched the whole video when it was posted up thread. As much as I disliked G+ when we bought it for HS and MK back in December, the video did open my eyes to how it levels the playing field better than FP+ did.

I still object to charging for it. And I dislike that it doesn't guarantee anything in exchange for your purchase. You are basically buying a lottery ticket for attraction line skipping. And as my husband says, "Lotteries are a tax on the mathematically challenged".

I'd like to address the supposed leveling of the playing field.

FP+ was free. G+ costs $15.98 per person. Everyone could afford FP+. Not everyone, especially people with families of 2 or more children, can afford G+. For anyone who doesn't have the extra funds, the playing field has been raised, not leveled, despite what Disney wants us to believe.

 

[Johtull12]

For that level of money, a family of 5 would be better off doing a VIP tour.

Minimum seven hours approximately $750 an hour With tip is over $6k per day. $300 a day pp family 5 is 75% cheaper but Being driven to each park in skipping even the lightning lanes using cast doors at times might be worth it for some on a short trip.

 

[Marionnette]

I'd like to address the supposed leveling of the playing field.

FP+ was free. G+ costs $15.98 per person. Everyone could afford FP+. Not everyone, especially people with families of 2 or more children, can afford G+. For anyone who doesn't have the extra funds, the playing field has been raised, not leveled, despite what Disney wants us to believe.

Did you watch the video? There's a lot in it to unpack and a Cliff Notes version here will not do it justice.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I guess I just find it depressing that so many places that Disney people frequent (this board, various FB groups) are filled with so many complaints. Of course there are things Disney should improve, but I wish folks would balance things out a bit, rather than focusing so much on the negative.

It's people's opinions, no one should feel like they have to balance it out just cuz. That's when you just have different posters join to give their thoughts. You've been very active on this thread so if it's depressing to read (either here or on FB) take a break from it all.

There will always been comments of disappointment sometimes though you'll find some points in time having more than others. This is one of those times with the changes that have been made and the overall feeling of Disney that you'll be hearing more of disappointment, if that's how people feel that's how they feel, ya know?

 

[mercuryvenus]

It's people's opinions, no one should feel like they have to balance it out just cuz. That's when you just have different posters join to give their thoughts. You've been very active on this thread so if it's depressing to read (either here or on FB) take a break from it all.

There will always been comments of disappointment sometimes though you'll find some points in time having more than others. This is one of those times with the changes that have been made and the overall feeling of Disney that you'll be hearing more of disappointment, if that's how people feel that's how they feel, ya know?

And likewise, I have the right to continue to be thrilled.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I'd like to address the supposed leveling of the playing field.

FP+ was free. G+ costs $15.98 per person. Everyone could afford FP+. Not everyone, especially people with families of 2 or more children, can afford G+. For anyone who doesn't have the extra funds, the playing field has been raised, not leveled, despite what Disney wants us to believe.

The leveling of the playing field is more how it functions. Cost in this case would take a backseat to that. I don't disagree with "included in admission" vs "a monetary cost" means some people are shut out (either by choice or actually financially) but when the descriptor of leveling the playing field is used to describe Genie+ it's more of how the program works especially with day of vs advanced and especially when you consider how advance was broken up into onsite vs off site.

 

[Smugpugmug]

I'd like to address the supposed leveling of the playing field.

FP+ was free. G+ costs $15.98 per person. Everyone could afford FP+. Not everyone, especially people with families of 2 or more children, can afford G+. For anyone who doesn't have the extra funds, the playing field has been raised, not leveled, despite what Disney wants us to believe.

The playing field being referred to in this context isn't so much the price but the ability to pick attractions. Remove the cost aspect for a moment and let's discuss the way of actually choosing which rides to book. With Fastpass+ hotel guests could book at 60 days, offsite at 30 and people staying at club level had the ability to buy 3 additional Fastpasses. Even if you were staying onsite, if you did not know the ins and outs of the system you were not going to get the big rides like Slinky, FOP and Mine Train. And then there were guests going to WDW that didn't even know Fastpass+ was a thing before their actual park day. By the time that happens, the only thing actually bookable was Barnstormer for 7:30 pm.

With Genie+, it's day of only. Everyone has a shot of getting the big rides at 7 am. Yes, there's the price aspect and you also need to be Disney savvy to get your moneys worth, but the fact that it's day of is how the playing field is being leveled.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

And likewise, I have the right to continue to be thrilled.

But no one is telling you to be less thrilled, no one is telling you to stop having fun at Disney because they aren't or to stop going to Disney because they have decided to stop going. You are however telling people to stop being so negative because it's depressing to read. So again if that's how it's making you feel take a breather, people can't just even out their posting because of it, they post what they feel. I'm certainly not asking you to be less chipper lol but you're telling people to be more chipper.

 

[leiaorgana]

The thing is this board is not at all representative of the average WDW guest.

I’d disagree with that. Take one look at Tripadvisor, Twitter, TikTok or Reddit and you’ll see more people on there with the same viewpoints and complaints that people are voicing on here and on other Disney focused message boards. The general public are just as unhappy and disappointed with the Disney company as people on here are. WDW has been getting a lot of bad reviews on Tripadvisor from first timers over the last year.

I know people in my personal life that have gone for the first time this year and said they wouldn’t be going back again because it wasn’t what they expected it to be. They sent me pictures of all of the trash in the ride queues and around the park and told me about how rude some of the CM’s where to them - eye rolling when asking a question, being told to just follow everyone else when asking for directions and then being ignored when they had a follow up question, not knowing where the mailboxes were on Main Street and just shrugging their shoulders and telling them to “just look around” and then the worst one was from a friend who saw a CM yell at a Dad who had taken their crying baby out of the queue to see Mickey at MK and was shouting at him for rejoining his family in the queue once he’d been able to calm them down again and the rest of the people in the queue around him had to defend him from the CM. How is that a good guest experience?

 

[DCLMP]

That’s why my strategy works so well, although I don’t really consider 9 pm as Night Owl territory.

Guests arrive way too early in the morning and eventually tire out well before the crowds die down.

As for the little kids, they may surprise you when it comes to Disney. My fondest Disney memory is chasing my then 3 year old daughter back to the entrance of Space Mountain moments before midnight with her screaming “One More Time Daddy” all the way.

9pm is late for me. I rarely stay up past 10 pm. I'm a morning person. I'd much be up at 4am than be in the parks at night. I'm glad it works out for you.

 

[lugnut33]

All I can say is that we’ve had a terrific time over our past 3 trips — Feb 2020, Nov 2021, and just last week. It’s unfortunate that Disney has failed the rest of you so significantly, but we’ve truly loved our time. We can’t wait to go back for our daughter’s 6th birthday in October.

Don't get me wrong, me and my adult daughters had a wonderful time when we were there. We would go again, but that doesn't mean everything was perfect. Example, Genie+ was easily the #1 stress inducing thing about the trip (and we got lucky it worked well for us).

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I’d disagree with that. Take one look at Tripadvisor, Twitter, TikTok or Reddit and you’ll see more people on there with the same viewpoints and complaints that people are voicing on here and on other Disney focused message boards. The general public are just as unhappy and disappointed with the Disney company as people on here are. WDW has been getting a lot of bad reviews on Tripadvisor from first timers over the last year.

I agree.

Over time it is true that the Boards don't represent the average Disney guest and we typically say this Board skews higher on the income bracket. That part I'll say is still true on both accounts. But that in itself does not mean that the fairly consistent criticisms aren't valid irrespective of this Board because they sure are coming across multiple media (this Board, travel review sites, FB, news articles which take that as you will, other social media, etc) as consistent enough with the same overall feelings.

I sure don't think all the people in line around me throughout my trip were part of these Boards but I def. heard a lot of complaints and grumblings that seem to echo much of what I've been seeing here on the Boards.

 

[DCLMP]

Don't get me wrong, me and my adult daughters had a wonderful time when we were there. We would go again, but that doesn't mean everything was perfect. Example, Genie+ was easily the #1 stress inducing thing about the trip (and we got lucky it worked well for us).

That pretty much sums up our trip. I'm not sure what a perfect trip looks like. We've been every year since 2017 and every year has been different. Our dystopic trip in the Summer of 2020 was something I'll never forget. We've never had a bad trip and we'll be back in a year or two. Hopefully, they'll have all the kinks worked out.

 

[Babe the Blue Ox]

9pm is late for me. I rarely stay up past 10 pm. I'm a morning person. I'd much be up at 4am than be in the parks at night. I'm glad it works out for you.

Thanks, we like to try to set a challenge for ourselves most evenings just to see if we can meet it.

This time, the goal was to ride Rise twice before close. We hit the ride at 7:40 pm and found an 85 minute posted wait time. The actual wait was 15 minutes the first time then 5 minutes the 2nd time through.

We could have done a 3rd but opted for Tower instead. The posted wait over there was 80 minutes with a 10 minute actual wait time.

All done in less than an hour and a half. That’s how you close a park.

 

[mercuryvenus]

Thanks, we like to try to set a challenge for ourselves most evenings just to see if we can meet it.

This time, the goal was to ride Rise twice before close. We hit the ride at 7:40 pm and found an 85 minute posted wait time. The actual wait was 15 minutes the first time then 5 minutes the 2nd time through.

We could have done a 3rd but opted for Tower instead. The posted wait over there was 80 minutes with a 10 minute actual wait time.

All done in less than an hour and a half. That’s how you close a park.

In November, my husband and I did the mountain challenge in MK one night. This past trip, the kids were obsessed with doing Splash Mountain as many times as they could, so we managed to do it 3 times one evening.

 

[lugnut33]

I watched the whole video when it was posted up thread. As much as I disliked G+ when we bought it for HS and MK back in December, the video did open my eyes to how it levels the playing field better than FP+ did.

I still object to charging for it. And I dislike that it doesn't guarantee anything in exchange for your purchase. You are basically buying a lottery ticket for attraction line skipping. And as my husband says, "Lotteries are a tax on the mathematically challenged".

That is completely not what the video's conclusion was. Basically it was FP, FP+ and Genie are all able to be gamed, but you have to have the knowledge to be able to do that. Those with the knowledge get the most out of the system. That said, as crowds have rose over the years and Disney has not kept up with ride capacity, the person doing standby has been the most adversely affected by the Fast Pass systems. I don't remember the exact numbers, but total rides per day by someone using standby has fallen from around 8 down to 3 (depending on the crowds and the park). Magic Kingdom is the park that best handles crowds due to it's large amount of attractions and ride capacity.

 

[Disturbia]

We viewed the projections by just standing behind the partner statue. We’ve never paid for a dessert party.

We have a party of 5 (2 of our kids are young). We also have a double stroller so unless we line up 2 hours ahead of time, we can’t get a view with the current crowds. With ADRs and mid day breaks we can’t waste any more time lining up.

 

[igrsod]

That is completely not what the video's conclusion was. Basically it was FP, FP+ and Genie are all able to be gamed, but you have to have the knowledge to be able to do that. Those with the knowledge get the most out of the system. That said, as crowds have rose over the years and Disney has not kept up with ride capacity, the person doing standby has been the most adversely affected by the Fast Pass systems. I don't remember the exact numbers, but total rides per day by someone using standby has fallen from around 8 down to 3 (depending on the crowds and the park). Magic Kingdom is the park that best handles crowds due to it's large amount of attractions and ride capacity.

That is it for the most part... you need things that eat up crowds. More experiences, shows, rides etc. If all there are to do is a few rides, then everyone is in line. Lights Motors Action for example... so many people multiple times a day watching that show instead of in line.

 

[mercuryvenus]

We have a party of 5 (2 of our kids are young). We also have a double stroller so unless we line up 2 hours ahead of time, we can’t get a view with the current crowds. With ADRs and mid day breaks we can’t waste any more time lining up.

We showed up an hour ahead of time with 9 people: 6 adults and 3 kids, aged 5, 9, and 11. We had a stroller as well. We grabbed a spot behind the partner statue (not right behind, but just across that little path, near the railings). A couple of us went to get Starbucks and we were well situated to see everything.

 

[Marionnette]

That is completely not what the video's conclusion was. Basically it was FP, FP+ and Genie are all able to be gamed, but you have to have the knowledge to be able to do that. Those with the knowledge get the most out of the system. That said, as crowds have rose over the years and Disney has not kept up with ride capacity, the person doing standby has been the most adversely affected by the Fast Pass systems. I don't remember the exact numbers, but total rides per day by someone using standby has fallen from around 8 down to 3 (depending on the crowds and the park). Magic Kingdom is the park that best handles crowds due to it's large amount of attractions and ride capacity.

I agree with most of what you have posted. However, I understood those points prior to watching the video. What I took away, as new knowledge, was the way that FP+ impacted standby lines moreso than G+ is expected to.