Davids DVC: Rental reimbursement or rescheduling?

[Bearval]

Hello! Thanks so much for this. The credit card just asked me for additional info. Can you explain how the absence of the force majeure clause and the acclamation will help in my request for a refund? I googled but am not a lawyer!

I think spell check took over and they meant accomendations not acclamation. They had stated in their contract there was language if there were no accommodations available they were due a refund. If David's did not stipulate in their documents that a voucher would be given in place of a refund then they have to get a refund. They are hoping you accept the voucber

 

[Sandisw]

Hello! Thanks so much for this. The credit card just asked me for additional info. Can you explain how the absence of the force majeure clause and the acclamation will help in my request for a refund? I googled but am not a lawyer!

Here is what I might add to the information. It’s part of the contract with my renter, but you should have it in yours

 

[Bearval]

Here is what I might add to the information. It’s part of the contract with my renter, but you should have it in yours

View attachment 495415

That pretty much sinks his battleship

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

That pretty much sinks his battleship

I'll avoid the temptation to add a meme here and just say... it might not if the card company considers refunding via a voucher an acceptable form of refund. Ordinarily, it might not be ok to issue a voucher instead of a cash refund unless it was spelled out as an option in the contract. But with COVID, all bets seem to be off with regards to this.

 

[Sandisw]

I'll avoid the temptation to add a meme here and just say... it might not if the card company considers refunding via a voucher an acceptable form of refund. Ordinarily, it might not be ok to issue a voucher instead of a cash refund unless it was spelled out as an option in the contract. But with COVID, all bets seem to be off with regards to this.

I am thinking that a CC would still see this as something that entitles the renter since no mention of a voucher implies it will be actual money back..or at the very least, that is what the renter assumed it would be.

Based on now 2 wins with chargebacks, I’d be surprised if most, if not all renters, will prevail.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

Per Chase - because of COVID and people not able or wanting to travel you are not forced to take a voucher - hence why I won the chargeback with American Airlines - I could not use the voucher before it expired and Chase said it was unacceptable - I wasn't even calling on a dispute for the airlines - it came up in conversation and Chase told me to file a dispute.

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

I'm not surprised CCs are siding with the customers. But I just recall some earlier reports that many were allowing airlines, etc. to issue vouchers as adequate compensation.

 

[Sandisw]

I'm not surprised CCs are siding with the customers. But I just recall some earlier reports that many were allowing airlines, etc. to issue vouchers as adequate compensation.

Yes, I think maybe in Canada? But, many airlines here are still processing refunds,

Delta just completely changed my flights from one layover to two and arrival time went from noon to 8 pm. Called and no issues being refunded.

 

[Bearval]

I'll avoid the temptation to add a meme here and just say... it might not if the card company considers refunding via a voucher an acceptable form of refund. Ordinarily, it might not be ok to issue a voucher instead of a cash refund unless it was spelled out as an option in the contract. But with COVID, all bets seem to be off with regards to this.

Language early states refund will be in U.S. dollars. The " Return/Refund " policy has to specify state what a refund is to be if it is not a return of cash.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

Delta did that to me - changed from one layover to 4 - which made the flight impossible to make as the layovers overlapped the flight times with the connections - then argued with me about the flight making it with the connections - eventually got them to admit the flight would not work - so they refunded my ticket and not DH ticket even thou we were on the same number - what the heck! After another 6 hour hold - they had to reinstate DH ticket because they could see it but not credit it (?) then they refunded the new ticket.
I would never had known about this at all if they had not sent an email telling me how much they were looking forward to me flying with them as I thought the flight was cancelled back in March when I called them.

 

[Yinn]

Now it will be interesting to see if his message to owners changes at all.

You mean that now he has to manage both vouchers and cash refunds? A chargeback is probably a nail in the coffin.

I don't know how he's going to be able to bleed cash without going after owners for it. Then the owners he's going after, they're not going to want to give points up for him to fulfill vouchers. This is going to spiral fast.

 

[Bearval]

You mean that now he has to manage both vouchers and cash refunds? A chargeback is probably a nail in the coffin.

I don't know how he's going to be able to bleed cash without going after owners for it. Then the owners he's going after, they're not going to want to give points up for him to fulfill vouchers. This is going to spiral fast.

It is not as bad as you would think for him. I put that in post 3232.

 

[Sandisw]

You mean that now he has to manage both vouchers and cash refunds? A chargeback is probably a nail in the coffin.

I don't know how he's going to be able to bleed cash without going after owners for it. Then the owners he's going after, they're not going to want to give points up for him to fulfill vouchers. This is going to spiral fast.

Just wondering if Anything changes in dealing with specific owners whose renters win.

Like I said, I am dreading having a rental upcoming, just because I am doubtful of how things are going to progress, even if opened.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

I have one rental with Disney closed - One rental in June which I am thinking Disney will be closed and one in Sept which who knows?? As I have stated before - I am not holding my breath thinking that David's will pay me the 30% if the resort is open as he is playing by rules he sets by the minute.

 

[BDJazz]

Hello all,

Im writing for some clarification. As an owner who rented points to a family, whose vacation was cancelled in May, my preference would have been to work directly with the owners to work something out. Am I correct in reading that if my points are now re-rented, they are subject to a new contract putting liability on me to refund money? I certainly don't want to screw over the renters, but I will not agree to terms of a new contract that puts liability on me. Trying to let my conscience be my guide, but it seems to me that requesting me to refund money to him, but not offering cash refunds to his renters puts me in a situation to look like the "bad guy". Any stipulation out there that says I can't contact the renters directly and work something out? My fear would be that he starts renting out the contracts that expire soonest, and my points maybe being rented last minute, or maybe not at all?? Then would he try and come after my $$ at that time?

 

[Disneyepcot]

Your owner must have had points that they could rerent; therefore refunding their payment to David's and he could refund you.
I also had a March reservation and my owner had points expiring May 31 so I was not offered a refund. I was only offered the possibility of the owner rescheduling my trip in April or May. Hence, I opted to refuse and put in for the CC chargeback. I was never offered the voucher and I am being patient as I wait for my dispute to hopefully be resolved in my favor.

UPDATE: I just called Chase to check on my dispute and they said it has been resolved in my favor with my funds now permanently in my account and the confirmation letter is in the mail.

ETA: I submitted my claim March 19 over the phone, before it got extremely busy, and was never asked to send any other information.

 

[banzai75]

UPDATE: I just called Chase to check on my dispute and they said it has been resolved in my favor with my funds now permanently in my account and the confirmation letter is in the mail.

when did you submit claim?

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

UPDATE: I just called Chase to check on my dispute and they said it has been resolved in my favor with my funds now permanently in my account and the confirmation letter is in the mail.

 

[CraigInPA]

Hello all,

Im writing for some clarification. As an owner who rented points to a family, whose vacation was cancelled in May, my preference would have been to work directly with the owners to work something out. Am I correct in reading that if my points are now re-rented, they are subject to a new contract putting liability on me to refund money? I certainly don't want to screw over the renters, but I will not agree to terms of a new contract that puts liability on me. Trying to let my conscience be my guide, but it seems to me that requesting me to refund money to him, but not offering cash refunds to his renters puts me in a situation to look like the "bad guy". Any stipulation out there that says I can't contact the renters directly and work something out? My fear would be that he starts renting out the contracts that expire soonest, and my points maybe being rented last minute, or maybe not at all?? Then would he try and come after my $$ at that time?

By all means reach out to the renter. David's does not want you to do it, because it prevents him from charging the renter the new higher rental price. David's did tell some owners that he would pay them the 30% remaining if both parties report that they have successfully re-scheduled. Note that this really only works if your renter can travel before your points expire, and needs pretty much the same number of points.

If you and the renter can't work it out, then you have a choice whether to allow David's to re-rent your points. If you decide not to, you do NOT have to give him a refund of the 70% you've received. If you decide you will allow David's to re-rent the points, demand that he pay the remaining 30% upon you providing a confirmation number, not when the member checks in. David's could be heading into bankruptcy, and you were due your money the May day that was the original check in day. Allowing David's to push that payment date back months increases the chance that you will never receive it. do NOT agree to the new rental agreement. Tell Davids that if they want to re-rent your points, it is under the old rental agreement. The new agreement requires the owner to provide a full refund in the event of a future resort closure. No owner should have to agree to that.

 

[BDJazz]

By all means reach out to the renter. David's does not want you to do it, because it prevents him from charging the renter the new higher rental price. David's did tell some owners that he would pay them the 30% remaining if both parties report that they have successfully re-scheduled. Note that this really only works if your renter can travel before your points expire, and needs pretty much the same number of points.

If you and the renter can't work it out, then you have a choice whether to allow David's to re-rent your points. If you decide not to, you do NOT have to give him a refund of the 70% you've received. If you decide you will allow David's to re-rent the points, demand that he pay the remaining 30% upon you providing a confirmation number, not when the member checks in. David's could be heading into bankruptcy, and you were due your money the May day that was the original check in day. Allowing David's to push that payment date back months increases the chance that you will never receive it. do NOT agree to the new rental agreement. Tell Davids that if they want to re-rent your points, it is under the old rental agreement. The new agreement requires the owner to provide a full refund in the event of a future resort closure. No owner should have to agree to that.

Thank you for the info. I did verbally consent to re-rental but was never given the terms, as it was a phone conversation. I just reached out via e-mail to inquire about the terms should I re-rent the points, stating I wouldn't abide by a contract that put me at risk. I was never told the new contract terms had changed when I verbally gave that consent, so I'm hoping i haven't just made a mistake? I'm assuming this is just something that I would find out at the point in time someone new wants to re-rent the points, at which point I would decline? Its so tough as I want what's best for me, my renters, and in all honesty David as well. I've used him in the past and has always been great to work with. As an owner, I appreciate having a way to rent my points.