GRAND OPENING - GRAND CLOSING (Florida)

[Jrb1979]

What's the most frustrating about all of this, is how people keep searching for whatever makes the numbers look good. First it was death rate, then positive percentage, now it's hospital rates and death rates again. All I know is that this is far from over and we need to stop downplaying it. Stop searching to make things look better then they are. If you want good numbers take a look at Ontario Canada.

Over 23000 tests and 191 new cases.

 

[tippity]

Yup we should be worried about our hospital bed census here in Arizona. I went to target the other day to do order pick up and no one except me and the employees were wearing masks. At the grocery store very few people are wearing masks, which is concerning since the grocery store I go to has a high percentage of senior citizen shoppers.

Hospital Census in AZ: Elective surgeries have resumed, so the hospital census has increased. But According the the AZ health dept. ICU bed availability has hovered around 15 -25 % since the beginning of June. There are plenty of beds available. There are also plenty of ventilators.

I'm not basing my opinion on what I see in the local stores, I'm looking at the AZ Dept of Health website.

This virus is a fact. It's not going away, but I am tired of all of the gloom and doom reports of what's to come. The virus is mutating. Couldn't that result in less virulence?

 

[Christine]

This virus is a fact. It's not going away, but I am tired of all of the gloom and doom reports of what's to come. The virus is mutating. Couldn't that result in less virulence?

While admittedly I don't read everything about the virus, I've only read about one real mutation and that was the split from the original virus in Wuhan to the mutation that occurred in Europe. Most people on the west coast of the U.S. got the original Wuhan virus while most people on the East Coast got the Europe version which is suspected to be a more virulent strain/mutation.

 

[tippity]

What's the most frustrating about all of this, is how people keep searching for whatever makes the numbers look good. First it was death rate, then positive percentage, now it's hospital rates and death rates again. All I know is that this is far from over and we need to stop downplaying it. Stop searching to make things look better then they are. If you want good numbers take a look at Ontario Canada.

Over 23000 tests and 191 new cases.

No one is denying that the virus is here and will continue. It will also continue to kill people.

But the purpose of the lock down was to prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed.

As a result of that, community hospitals stopped performing elective surgeries and started laying off their personnel... In a lot of areas, these hospitals may not survive.

 

[osufeth24]

 

[jlwhitney]

Normally, I would agree with this statement 100%. But what about is the situation like this pandemic where I don't control what you do, and what you do or don't do could potentially impact so many other people, including me? I can control my cleanliness, my mask, and a few other things. But if I'm in the grocery store or an amusement park where masks are required, and someone ignores the distancing recommendations or refuses to wear a mask, my control is gone at that point. And with approximately 1/3 of the cases being people who don't show symptoms - it's impossible to tell who might be contagious and who's not. There is nothing available to us right now to determine that.

It's easy to look at the numbers in so many different ways. Some of the "facts" listed in this post alone are either slanted or can't be proven.

It's a tough time.

then you shouldn’t leave your house. Can’t control people period. Could say that you don’t know who might be driving drunk on the roads so you shouldn’t drive on the roads .

people have been making choices that put others at risk for like ever. All we can do is determine the amount of risk we can handle to go out and about with our day.

 

[shelemm]

But the purpose of the lock down was to prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed.

That's a simplification.

There were other goals: Catch up with PPE supplies, testing and tracing, ventilators, quarantine of infected individuals.

Important points to consider:

With PPE, instead of increasing dramatically the production of N95 masks which were the high standard masks that we used to have, we have now accepted the use of lower quality KN95 Chinese masks.

Testing has increased per capita, but large swaths of the population who are the most vulnerable - like people who ride public transportation- have been widely ignored.

I have no idea how prepared we are for opening up in the Fall with the amount of ventilators we may need. So please let me know what info you have.

 

[shelemm]

Can’t control people period.

Actually, the USA was able to slow down deaths via behavior modification. Your use of punctuation is inapplicable.

Could say that you don’t know who might be driving drunk on the roads so you shouldn’t drive on the roads .

Again with the driving analogy! This is a much bigger problem and can impact anyone who needs food...medical supplies... or do you think all those folks in nursing homes were cruising the streets exposing themselves? Analogies are often fraught with problems, but this is one is truly pathetic. Hard to believe anyone still buys into this argument.

 

[jlwhitney]

Actually, the USA was able to slow down deaths via behavior modification. Your use of punctuation is inapplicable.

Whatever believe as you wish. Masks and social distancing isn’t law and no matter how much someone wants everyone to choose to follow it you can’t control it. Around here I here more I’m so glad you aren’t wearing a mask then anything else. Probably less than 10% are wearing them now.

 

[Jrb1979]

Whatever believe as you wish. Masks and social distancing isn’t law and no matter how much someone wants everyone to choose to follow it you can’t control it. Around here I here more I’m so glad you aren’t wearing a mask then anything else. Probably less than 10% are wearing them now.

It really shows how little people care for others. We would be so much better off if we all just followed social distancing and wear masks when you can't be 6 ft apart. As well as wash hands. Its no wonder numbers are going up in many places. People just don't care all they want is normal back. Hate to break it to you but the longer you don't care the longer all of us have to deal with this.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

What's the most frustrating about all of this, is how people keep searching for whatever makes the numbers look good. First it was death rate, then positive percentage, now it's hospital rates and death rates again. All I know is that this is far from over and we need to stop downplaying it. Stop searching to make things look better then they are. If you want good numbers take a look at Ontario Canada.

Over 23000 tests and 191 new cases.

No, you are picking and choosing which numbers to use to make it look the way you want. That goes both ways. Stop looking at one day totals and look at the overall picture and trends.

I clearly laid out the numbers for Ontario, Florida and California for you last night. They ALL came from the official dashboards. Right now the death rate in Ontario is double that of Florida and California. The rest of the stats, except actual number of cases, are right in the same ballpark. You can't compare Ontario and California in total number of cases, when the population is 2.5x greater in California.

And no, what I've said to look for has not changed. That is and has been positive percentage, hospitalizations rates AND death rates. Looking at case count alone doesn't tell you anything except that virus exists.

 

[JimMIA]

Whatever believe as you wish. Masks and social distancing isn’t law and no matter how much someone wants everyone to choose to follow it you can’t control it. Around here I here more I’m so glad you aren’t wearing a mask then anything else. Probably less than 10% are wearing them now.

Where in Florida do you live?

 

[Jrb1979]

No, you are picking and choosing which numbers to use to make it look the way you want. That goes both ways. Stop looking at one day totals and look at the overall picture and trends.

I clearly laid out the numbers for Ontario, Florida and California for you last night. They ALL came from the official dashboards. Right now the death rate in Ontario is double that of Florida and California. The rest of the stats, except actual number of cases, are right in the same ballpark. You can't compare Ontario and California in total number of cases, when the population is 2.5x greater in California.

And no, what I've said to look for has not changed. That is and has been positive percentage, hospitalizations rates AND death rates. Looking at case count alone doesn't tell you anything except that virus exists.

I'm not picking and choosing numbers. I'm just showing people what good numbers look like. Yes with cases rising that very much means its still here. That's what frustrates me is seeing so many not care to follow social distancing.

I may be Canadian but my summer vacations revolve around going to U.S. theme parks. The way cases are going at this rate I may never get to enjoy my vacations

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

I'm not picking and choosing numbers. I'm just showing people what good numbers look like. Yes with cases rising that very much means its still here. That's what frustrates me is seeing so many not care to follow social distancing.

I may be Canadian but my summer vacations revolve around going to U.S. theme parks. The way cases are going at this rate I may never get to enjoy my vacations

So is your concern really just your vacation plans?

And yes, you will. It may not be until next year, but things won't stay this way forever. The virus may not be gone next year, but there will be a new normal. Borders will reopen. And vacations for us in the US also got cancelled! You're not alone in that.

 

[Searc]

It really shows how little people care for others. We would be so much better off if we all just followed social distancing and wear masks when you can't be 6 ft apart. As well as wash hands. Its no wonder numbers are going up in many places. People just don't care all they want is normal back. Hate to break it to you but the longer you don't care the longer all of us have to deal with this.

Cases are increasing because American's have the attention span of a gnat and got bored with the virus.

 

[tippity]

That's a simplification.

There were other goals: Catch up with PPE supplies, testing and tracing, ventilators, quarantine of infected individuals.

Important points to consider:

With PPE, instead of increasing dramatically the production of N95 masks which were the high standard masks that we used to have, we have now accepted the use of lower quality KN95 Chinese masks.

Testing has increased per capita, but large swaths of the population who are the most vulnerable - like people who ride public transportation- have been widely ignored.

I have no idea how prepared we are for opening up in the Fall with the amount of ventilators we may need. So please let me know what info you have.

I can tell you about AZ: 685 ( 38%) ventilators are in use ( for COVID and Non Covid) and there are 1,114 ( 62%) available.

I know the virus is serious, but I also know that reports of child abuse have dramatically decreased because teachers don't have eyes on their students, I also know that domestic violence has increased.

I don't think our economy can remain shut down. The social distancing and wearing masks may become requirements, but I don't think closing down again is an option. The most vulnerable people in our society are the ones who are fighting to survive.

 

[Jrb1979]

So is your concern really just your vacation plans?

And yes, you will. It may not be until next year, but things won't stay this way forever. The virus may not be gone next year, but there will be a new normal. Borders will reopen. And vacations for us in the US also got cancelled! You're not alone in that.

My concern is more then my vacation plans. I am saddened how little concern a lot have for others. I get frustrated cause it's so easy to just follow simple guidelines. If everyone did it we could easily open everything. It really isn't hard to practice social distancing, wear a mask when needed and wash your hands. For many its like building a pyramid.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

My concern is more then my vacation plans. I am saddened how little concern a lot have for others. I get frustrated cause it's so easy to just follow simple guidelines. If everyone did it we could easily open everything. It really isn't hard to practice social distancing, wear a mask when needed and wash your hands. For many its like building a pyramid.

I agree with you. It’s unfortunate people won’t listen to basic rules that have been found to help. Thankfully I live in an area where masks are required, which is probably why the reopening here doesn’t scare me.

How long this is sustainable though is another question. I think people will be good about it here for awhile, but I see complacency waning after a while.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Cases are increasing because American's have the attention span of a gnat and got bored with the virus.

It’s more than that and you know that. While I agree masks and social distancing should be easy and I do wish it required nationwide, a long term lockdown was not sustainable for many reasons. Boredom isn’t the only reason.

 

[bb32]

Obviously with NYC numbers subsiding the overall US total will reflect that. Texas and Arizona has set new all time highs in hospitalizations this week and more hotspots such as Florida are growing. All three states represent possible increases that any state could see.