Choosing National Parks

[bcla]

The Canadians are apparently not aware that they aren't allowed to buy Senior Passes. A couple of years ago, I was talking to a friend at one of the entrance stations of Everglades NP when a herd of Canadian motorcyclists pulled up. Five couples on five big Harleys. They proudly presented their Senior Passes and their Quebec drivers licenses. Their Senior Passes were confiscated. No money back, no admission to the park, nothing. Needless to say, they were not happy and roared away rather than pay the entrance fee.

When I got the senior passes for my parents, there wasn't a check for any kind of legal status. They didn't even ask for ID or proof of age. So yeah it's possible to get them then have them taken away. Occasionally when using ask to see ID and my mom would pull our her California driver license.

I wouldn't assume that holding a Quebec driver license is an automatic sign of ineligibility. There are dual nationals. A US permanent resident (or dual national) might be able to live part time there.

 

[JimMIA]

When I got the senior passes for my parents, there wasn't a check for any kind of legal status. They didn't even ask for ID or proof of age. So yeah it's possible to get them then have them taken away. Occasionally when using ask to see ID and my mom would pull our her California driver license.

Actually, neither you nor I should have been able to purchase a Senior Pass for someone else. There is a requirement that the actual passholder purchase the pass, and they must submit proof of citizenship or permanent resident status at the time of purchase (although a drivers license is sufficient).

I've never purchased a Senior Pass online, so I don't know what kind of documentation is required there.

I was able to purchase my buddy's pass because I worked at Everglades as a seasonal ranger, and they knew I wasn't going to buy a pass for someone who didn't qualify. But technically, that was a violation of policy.

Also the technical requirement for using the pass for admission is to present the pass with proof of age such as a driver's license. Like everything else, what happens in the real world is not always in perfect alignment with the letter of the law -- so people are routinely admitted by just flashing the pass at the entrance station.

I wouldn't assume that holding a Quebec driver license is an automatic sign of ineligibility.

I wouldn't assume someone assumed, lol.

The fee collector in the situation I described did ask if they were dual citizens or permanent residents. The folks from Quebec said no -- they didn't know they were not supposed to have the passes, and a couple of them had been using the passes for several years.

 

[disneyseniors]

The trick is that Redwoods is on the coast and while there is a highway that goes there it is state route 101, which is a long way off of the interstate. We did the coastal route the whole way south until we got to LA. If you did it without stopping and enjoying any of scenery (which to me is what a road trip like that is all about) and took the interstate the whole way it might speed things up by three or four hours but that's without traffic. BTW, if you have the time that drive is totally worth it. Those scenic coastal highway views with the ocean on one side and the mountains on the other that you see in ads and movies all the time - that's 101 and 1 between LA and Redwoods NP.

Thanks again. We are retired, so we can take all the time we want. I definitely want to see the coast, so we will go that way and just plan for more time. I can't wait!

 

[bcla]

Actually, neither you nor I should have been able to purchase a Senior Pass for someone else. There is a requirement that the actual passholder purchase the pass, and they must submit proof of citizenship or permanent resident status at the time of purchase (although a drivers license is sufficient).

I've never purchased a Senior Pass online, so I don't know what kind of documentation is required there.

I was able to purchase my buddy's pass because I worked at Everglades as a seasonal ranger, and they knew I wasn't going to buy a pass for someone who didn't qualify. But technically, that was a violation of policy.

Also the technical requirement for using the pass for admission is to present the pass with proof of age such as a driver's license. Like everything else, what happens in the real world is not always in perfect alignment with the letter of the law -- so people are routinely admitted by just flashing the pass at the entrance station.

I wouldn't assume someone assumed, lol.

The fee collector in the situation I described did ask if they were dual citizens or permanent residents. The folks from Quebec said no -- they didn't know they were not supposed to have the passes, and a couple of them had been using the passes for several years.

Oh. If they admitted to it, then yes they should have been confiscated on the spot. Did it seem like they would have been OK if they said "We're dual citizens."?

I didn't walk up myself and ask to buy a senior pass. I was there with my mother/father and I just handed over the $10. They were specifically asked to sign each pass. I don't recall exactly if they were asked for proof of age. They definitely weren't asked for proof of status.

I've had some weird things happen with passes. Sometimes the pen I was given to sign didn't have terribly stable ink. I put my annual pass in my pocket and it got wet in a mist and the signature line turned into a smudge. The next time I used it, it got wiped off clean and I was asked to sign with a Sharpie. Once I just slipped it in a park map but dropped it accidentally. I went back to the entrance station and someone had found it and turned it in. I was also at a place where a Forest Service ranger was talking to someone complaining that NPS entrance stations weren't always asking people to sign their passes.

 

[VandVsmama]

Not sure if it's been mentioned, but if you're going to do a southern Utah-focused national park trip, you could consider also venturing over to New Mexico to look at Chaco Canyon. It's hard to get to and is a dirt road for awhile. But from this video, it's pretty darn spectacular.

 

[MrsPete]

The price of the lifetime senior pass is fixed at the price of the regular annual pass, which can change based on these federal agencies deciding on a price increase. The $20 per year is actually fixed in the law. So if the price ever went up to $120, it would still be $20 per year for the senior annual pass unless the law is changed, and still 4 passes turned in for a lifetime pass. Once the price of the lifetime pass goes up, getting the 4 annual passes makes more financial sense. That's one heck of a loophole.

I hear what you're saying, but any law can be changed. Yes, a law takes more effort to change than a rule. If you have the pass, you have the pass and you're "locked in".

They rent "jello boots" right there at the entrance to the park- highly recommend doing this for the Narrows. They're weird shoes that sluice the water thru as you walk,we are average walkers and spent 7 hours walking in and out again while there bc these boots enabled us to go farther. It was an awesome day.(we had to hike about 1/2 mile at least in to get past the crowds)

I'm so curious about these boots now.

A Note for our Canadian brothers and sisters:
Unfortunately, you are not authorized to purchase Senior Passes. Regular annual passes, yes; Senior Passes, NO. One must be a US citizen or permanent resident to purchase a Senior Pass.

No offense to our neighbors to the North, but I get it. We Americans support the national parks through our taxes.

It doesn't pertain to me -- I am and always have been an American citizen -- but what if you were an American citizen who purchased the pass, then moved to Canada? That'd really put you in an odd position.

We got the National Park game this summer and played it once. It's good, but the rules are sort of weird-- you are collecting cards, matching icons to cards, and traveling around the board. So I'm not sure if it's worth $50 if you're not going to play it a lot, but the parts (movable figures, board, cards) are of good quality, so that probably adds to the cost of the game. We'll have to give it a try on our next camping trip and see if we enjoy it more, without having to learn the rules all over. (I realize that's not super helpful)

No, I think you've talked me out of it. I was already a little turned off by the price.

Not sure if it's been mentioned, but if you're going to do a southern Utah-focused national park trip, you could consider also venturing over to New Mexico to look at Chaco Canyon. It's hard to get to and is a dirt road for awhile. But from this video, it's pretty darn spectacular.

I haven't been to Chaco Canyon, but now I want to visit! It looks something like Mesa Verde, which I found FASCINATING!

 

[RamblingMad]

It doesn't pertain to me -- I am and always have been an American citizen -- but what if you were an American citizen who purchased the pass, then moved to Canada? That'd really put you in an odd position.

Not really. I have a friend that lives in Edmonton that spends half of her time in AZ. Obviously, that's difficult this year.

 

[bcla]

I hear what you're saying, but any law can be changed. Yes, a law takes more effort to change than a rule. If you have the pass, you have the pass and you're "locked in".
I'm so curious about these boots now.
No offense to our neighbors to the North, but I get it. We Americans support the national parks through our taxes.

It doesn't pertain to me -- I am and always have been an American citizen -- but what if you were an American citizen who purchased the pass, then moved to Canada? That'd really put you in an odd position.
No, I think you've talked me out of it. I was already a little turned off by the price.
I haven't been to Chaco Canyon, but now I want to visit! It looks something like Mesa Verde, which I found FASCINATING!

There are various types of footwear. Here are some Adidas water boots.

That’s not quite what I saw. I saw these loose looking neoprene things that had Velcro and almost wrapped up the ankle like a medical brace.

As far as the senior pass goes, any US citizen at least 62 is good to go. Even an expat or someone who was born overseas to a US citizen parent. Most people don’t carry proof of citizenship. I’ve known senior pass holders born outside the US with accents, but naturalized citizens. They’ve never had a problem. It was always on the honor system, although age might have been checked.

 

[teller80]

Our shoes for the Narrows hike

 

[RamblingMad]

Our shoes for the Narrows hike
View attachment 534132

There is a store right outside of the Zion's entrance that rents shoes and a walking stick. That's what I did the last time I went there.

To really take advantage of the narrows, you want to repel down the other side. This is really a canyoneering park.

 

[bcla]

The issue with the Narrows is that all the rocks on the bottom are round and smooth. Hit one the wrong way and you can sprain your ankle and it's going to be miserable coming back, They're also slippery, so good wet grip is very important.

I found a photo of a 5.10 Canyoneer boot. 5.10 has some of the grippiest shoe rubber on the planet although it's not necessarily that durable. They make a lot of shoes for climbing, skateboarding, trick bicycling, etc. where grip is very important. This one has neoprene near the top that's locked in place. I think the other it does is keep the foot warm. Obviously you're not going to want to wear socks unless they're maybe neoprene to keep your feet warm like a wetsuit. But the most important thing is to have something that restricts the ankle. Their search and rescue reports are filled with bringing back people from The Narrows with ankle injuries or even broken ankles. Also slips.

 

[mrodgers]

I so want to go out west but it would take me probably 5 days just to get there comfortably on a motorcycle and 5 days back. Realistically I can only take a week off at a time, with super early planning 2 weeks. 2 weeks still doesn't leave time to do much when I get there.

 

[hsmamato2]

I'm so curious about these boots now.

I learned about them on trip advisor.... apparently there are a few shops right in town that rent them (or did) we weren't gonna spend the extra,but so glad we did, if we had our regular shoes/sandals on we wouldn't have walked in as far...and it was magnificent! Like I said, the little store right inside the entrance was really convenient.We call them jello boots bc that's what they feel like after sloshing thru the water It was like $25 a person at the time.

 

[JaxDad]

The Canadians are apparently not aware that they aren't allowed to buy Senior Passes.

I guess because the NPS keeps that information so obscure. Here are the first two bullets when you click on "Senior Passes" for more information:
Senior Pass

• Cost:
  • $80 Lifetime Senior Pass
  • $20 Annual Senior Pass
• Available for: U.S. citizens or permanent residents age 62 or over. Applicants must provide documentation of age and residency or citizenship.

 

[belleatdisney]

Trying to plan as well.

What month is the best to go to these parks? I was thinking April or May.

 

[JimMIA]

Trying to plan as well.

What month is the best to go to these parks? I was thinking April or May.

Which parks? Some parks are closed, or minimally open, in April/May. For others, it's the perfect time.

 

[bcla]

I guess because the NPS keeps that information so obscure. Here are the first two bullets when you click on "Senior Passes" for more information:
Senior Pass

• Cost:
  • $80 Lifetime Senior Pass
  • $20 Annual Senior Pass
• Available for: U.S. citizens or permanent residents age 62 or over. Applicants must provide documentation of age and residency or citizenship.

Yep. It's all over the place.

https://store.usgs.gov/senior-pass​

• For U.S. citizens or permanent residents age 62 or over.

BLM and Bueau of Reclamation link to the USGS website.

https://www.blm.gov/programs/recreation/passeshttps://www.usbr.gov/main/pass.html
Forest Service makes it pretty clear too. They are incorrect that it has to be obtained in person, as it can be ordered through the USGS. I guess maybe it has to be obtained in person if obtained through the Forest Service.

https://www.fs.usda.gov/visit/passes-permits/recreation-fees-passes​

Who Qualifies:​

Must be a citizen or permanent resident of the United States.​

• Must be 62 years of age or older.
• Must obtain in person.
• Must show proof of age, which may be a state driver's license showing birth date, a birth certificate, or similar document.

 

[bcla]

Trying to plan as well.

What month is the best to go to these parks? I was thinking April or May.

Summer is obviously the peak visitation season. The crowds may be higher, but it's also when more lodging options are available and more roads are open. NPS staffing could be minimal. But as was said, it depends on where.

Sometimes it can be difficult to plan well ahead because reservations can only be made months in advance without knowing if maybe a road is closed or if certain amenities are open. I've planned trips based on whether shuttle transportation would be available. I kept on checking and found that it had started, but I was worried about whether it might not be available.

A lot of the places mentioned are at high altitude and have lots of snow. Here's Yellowstone for example:

https://www.nps.gov/yell/planyourvisit/parkroads.htm
They have designated March closing dates for the roads to snow vehicle traffic. That means there will definitely be snow there and then they get them ready for plowing. How long that takes might depend on any number of factors including how much snow there is and whether it keeps on snowing.

 

[RamblingMad]

I tend to go to the NPs in the shoulder season while school is in session during the week.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I'm so glad I found this thread
My husband retires in a couple of weeks, and we are starting to plan a trip out West via Arizona to California. We want to hit the National parks, as many as we can! Can't wait to see the redwoods!
Thanks to everyone for the wonderful advice

We did a drive from Louisiana to San Diego one year. We stopped in Carlsbad Caverns, Grand Canyon, Painted Desert, Petrified Forest. As well as San Diego (my husband ran a marathon there) and the zoos there, plus San Juan Capistrano, DLR, Sedona, Santa Fe and more. It was a long trip, but very enjoyable. There was so much to see.